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Apsattv
29-02-2008, 04:44 AM
Some pics I was sent.

Looks like a lot of options. USB? and network socket... external USB hd anyone? how about plugging in a USB Playtv playstation stick to turn it into a dual tuner.. :rolleyes: might just be wishfull thinking.

I wonder what it has inside?

paulw
29-02-2008, 08:42 AM
Is this the $545 STB that has been mentioned??

kiwisteve
29-02-2008, 02:06 PM
Inside it has a big Chip that gets very warm !! :D:D:D:D

Apsattv
29-02-2008, 06:16 PM
Is this the $545 STB that has been mentioned??

Yes..actually it doesn't look all that "low end" the USB and Network port might open up some options as a multimedia device.

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 01:44 AM
THREAD BEING FIXED PLEASE NO POSTS HERE UNTIL I FIX IT

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 01:45 AM
Posted by Apsattv
31-03-2008, 07:27 PM

Ok so who has one?

Hints and tips ? complaints? reviews and pics of the unit to go in this thread?

Has anyone plugged one into a network or usb device?

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 01:47 AM
Posted by Green
31-03-2008, 07:45 PM

Plugged into ethernet - Laptop detected link, but packet sniffer showed that the Zinwell end remained slient (ie not requesting IP address via DHCP).
Plugged into USB HDD - Nothing much to report here either. No new options in the menu, 'File' button on remote still reports to 'empty' slots.

Interestingly enough, there is a firmware upgrade available for the Olevia branded device to enable USB HDD recording (pdf). Just not sure if I'm game enough to attempt such an upgrade just yet.

Some quick observations:
During the scan, you can see quick glances of the 'Reserved' feeds, but these are filtered out by the time you get to use the box. Haven't found any way to gain access to these hidden channels - this may be similar to the behaviour of the satellite receivers and may lock out consumers if a third party DTT provider ever pops up (Prime/Sky?)
Downscaling of the HD source to SD output doesn't appear to very good - for example, on Borderline just now there were a number of shots of computer screens and they shimmered quite a bit.
Channel changing isn't the fastest
There is a mention in the manual of a green LED when the device is running, but as others have since found out, this isn't the case.

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Apsattv
08-05-2008, 01:49 AM
Posted by Apsattv
31-03-2008, 07:57 PM


Originally Posted by Green
Plugged into ethernet - Laptop detected link, but packet sniffer showed that the Zinwell end remained slient (ie not requesting IP address via DHCP).

Plugged into USB HDD - Nothing much to report here either. No new options in the menu, 'File' button on remote still reports to 'empty' slots.

Interestingly enough, there is a firmware upgrade available for the Olevia branded device to enable USB HDD recording (pdf). Just not sure if I'm game enough to attempt such an upgrade just yet.

Heck go for it you can always take it back and claim it failed for some reason


damn must be a bug of this new early technology like previous Zinwells ...

Come on be a Pioneer, be the first one to make a great discovery...or stuff your box up

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 01:51 AM
Posted by Green
31-03-2008, 08:02 PM


Originally Posted by Apsattv
Heck go for it you can always take it back and claimed it failed for some reason

Umm, not quite. There is a Zinwell/NEXT Warranty section at the back of the manual:

"This warranty is only valid for appliances used according to the manufacturer's instructions" and "The appliance must not be modified of changed in any way".

So I'll leave it for at least a week before I get adventurous

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 01:54 AM
Posted by Apsattv
31-03-2008, 09:42 PM

Come on, how will the dummy at the store even know. Its a new product there's likely to be a few duds they will just put it away and give you another one.

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Apsattv
08-05-2008, 01:56 AM
Posted by Green
31-03-2008, 11:34 PM

If there is a FreeView hell, then I think I've just reserved my spot.

I have just upgraded my Zinwell ZMT-620FTA Freeview|HD receiver with the Olevia ZMT-620FTA firmware - and can now record to an attached USB HDD (with limitations).

Some lmitiations introduced:
AAC audio is not recorded. TV3 will play back fine with AC3, but other channel recordings appear to be silent
MHEG5 epg is broken. It now only shows now/next.
Automatic scan no longer works. You need to configure frequencies manually. (This page might help - but you need to enter in the center frequency). Bandwitdh is 8Mhz in NZ.

New Features:
Able to list/view _all_ channels present, including the Reserved channels.
Record to HDD (note limitations), plus what appears to be a photo viewer
Aspect ratios explained with 4:3 or 16:9 ratios, rather than just pillar box/letter box
Video formats: PAL, NTSC, 480p, 576p, 720p 50/60, 1080i 50/60, 1080p 24
720p over component! (Stunning, even with the crappy supplied cable!)

For those adventurous enough, firmwares can be found here. Personally, I did it one step at a time, following a 'valid' upgrade path. 1.0.2 -> 1.1.2 -> 1.2.2 -> 1.3.9

I did have problems with my USB Flash at times. Luckily I had a couple to play around with and managed to get things working in the end.

One last hint: Dark blue is the currently selected option. (Not light blue). This is very important when it asks you if you want Chinese or English. Get it wrong and you'll be using the menus blind - you've been warned!

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 01:58 AM
Posted by Apsattv
01-04-2008, 12:40 AM

Great work! more than enough benefits especially the last one 720P over component.

Is there anything on the reserved channels? or just blank?

Did you try the network port after doing the update?

P.S anyone else willing to "go to hell"?

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 03:09 AM
Posted by Green
01-04-2008, 08:39 AM

Reserved channels are just blank at this stage - although there is a tvCentral channel, even though I'm in the South Island. But don't get your hopes up, it's just rebroadcasting Maori TV.

Ethernet is still very silent.

It actually looks like you can do any of the HD over component btw. Initially I only had it set to 720p, but mucking around with it a bit more let me cycle through all the rest of the HD resolutions (easy to do with 'V.Format' on the remote) - with only 1080p 24 not working, but only because my TV doesn't support that.

It's interesting that Freeview decided to disable HD over component and lock out all the other 'fun' functionality. Now that we know that an Olevia box will work here (mostly), some people may just go ahead and order these boxes from Hong Kong, get HD over component anyway - and save themselves some money to boot.

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 03:16 AM
Posted by Openmedia
01-04-2008, 09:05 AM

Not going to be much use without HE-AAC support for the channels other than TV3 though will it?
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Apsattv
08-05-2008, 03:17 AM
Posted by Green
01-04-2008, 09:12 AM

It's only the recordings that don't appear to play back with sound. Normal viewing works fine with HEAAC.

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 03:18 AM
Posted by Paulw
01-04-2008, 10:24 AM

Hi Green

Thanx for the info. Your a brave man so early in the peice..

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 03:18 AM
Posted by Lotech
01-04-2008, 01:08 PM

Awesome job! I love breaking things with hacks.
Have you plugged the drive into a computer yet? What does the file structure and file formats look like? There is a chance the sound could be being recorded - just not able to be played back?

Peter Griffin posted on his nzherald blog that DSE is selling them for $399 - their site still lists them as $549? Anyone seen this cheaper price?

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 03:47 AM
Posted by Kenj
01-04-2008, 01:28 PM


Originally Posted by lotech
Awesome job! I love breaking things with hacks.
Have you plugged the drive into a computer yet? What does the file structure and file formats look like? There is a chance the sound could be being recorded - just not able to be played back?

Peter Griffin posted on his nzherald blog that DSE is selling them for $399 - their site still lists them as $549? Anyone seen this cheaper price?

They were at that price up till a day ago - as "New low Price" Things have changed in the last 24 hours.

Ken

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 03:48 AM
Posted by GrahamW
01-04-2008, 01:41 PM

ZMT-620HD Unauthorised SW Changes Voids Warranty
AMAZED TO SEE SO MANY 'TECHIES' INTERESTED IN VIEWING THE ZINWELL FREEVIEW DVB-T ZMT-620HD RECEIVER HOWEVER;---

1. UNAUTHORISED SW CHANGE TO THE ZMT-620HD RECEIVER WILL VOID THE RECEIVER WARRANTY.

2. ANY CHANGE TO SW WILL IMMEDIATELY REFLECT IN RECEIVER SYSTEM INFORMATION AND HIGHLIGHT WARRANTY VOIDANCE NOTIFICATION.

3. THE FREEVIEW ZMT-620HD APPROVED RECEIVER HAS TUNING SW FOR NEW ZEALAND TO ADDRESS MFN AND SFN RECEPTION. UNAUTHORISED SW CHANGE WILL IMPACT RECEPTION.

4. UNAUTHORISED SW CHANGE WILL NULLIFY RECEIVER'S CAPABILITY FOR FUTURE DOWNLOADING OF ENHANCED FEATURES .

5. SW FOR THE ZINWELL RECEIVER HONG KONG DESIGN IS INCOMPATIBLE WITH THE FREEVIEW ZINWELL ZMT-620HD APPROVED NEW ZEALAND RECEIVER.

"INNOVATORS" ARE WARNED AGAINST UNAUTHORISED SW CHANGES .


ZINWELL CORPORATION

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 03:57 AM
Posted by PaulW
01-04-2008, 04:42 PM



Originally Posted by kenj
They were at that price up till a day ago - as "New low Price" Things have changed in the last 24 hours.

Ken

What a rip off. Advertizing at $399 but no product to sell. Now jacking them back up to $500 plus still with no product. Roll on some cheaper units..

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 03:58 AM
Posted by Kenj
01-04-2008, 05:00 PM


Originally Posted by paulw
What a rip off. Advertizing at $399 but no product to sell. Now jacking them back up to $500 plus still with no product. Roll on some cheaper units..

I emailed them at 1pm today asking what the heck was going on. No reply yet.

Am I expecting too much?

Ken

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:00 AM
Posted by Lotech
01-04-2008, 05:54 PM


Originally Posted by grahamw
AMAZED TO SEE SO MANY 'TECHIES' INTERESTED IN VIEWING THE ZINWELL FREEVIEW DVB-T ZMT-620HD RECEIVER HOWEVER;---

1. UNAUTHORISED SW CHANGE TO THE ZMT-620HD RECEIVER WILL VOID THE RECEIVER WARRANTY.

2. ANY CHANGE TO SW WILL IMMEDIATELY REFLECT IN RECEIVER SYSTEM INFORMATION AND HIGHLIGHT WARRANTY VOIDANCE NOTIFICATION.

3. THE FREEVIEW ZMT-620HD APPROVED RECEIVER HAS TUNING SW FOR NEW ZEALAND TO ADDRESS MFN AND SFN RECEPTION. UNAUTHORISED SW CHANGE WILL IMPACT RECEPTION.

4. UNAUTHORISED SW CHANGE WILL NULLIFY RECEIVER'S CAPABILITY FOR FUTURE DOWNLOADING OF ENHANCED FEATURES .

5. SW FOR THE ZINWELL RECEIVER HONG KONG DESIGN IS INCOMPATIBLE WITH THE FREEVIEW ZINWELL ZMT-620HD APPROVED NEW ZEALAND RECEIVER.

"INNOVATORS" ARE WARNED AGAINST UNAUTHORISED SW CHANGES .


ZINWELL CORPORATION

Why are you yelling? If you're an official representative of Zinwell then please specify who you are, and your position - coming to a forum and yelling doesn't make for good company relations.

Based on what you say, which is to say the least is obvious, if we take an object which we paid for, we hack it, and it breaks, it voids warranty. Ok. Thankfully we don't have DMCA like laws in NZ.


Quote:

5. SW FOR THE ZINWELL RECEIVER HONG KONG DESIGN IS INCOMPATIBLE WITH THE FREEVIEW ZINWELL ZMT-620HD APPROVED NEW ZEALAND RECEIVER.

Well we've already proven thats wrong - its the same hardware, same box - just a different logo on the front.
The NZ firmware is designed and setup to NZ specs, obviously the HK isn't.

Oh and finally -

Quote:

4. UNAUTHORISED SW CHANGE WILL NULLIFY RECEIVER'S CAPABILITY FOR FUTURE DOWNLOADING OF ENHANCED FEATURES .

What enhanced features? If you made it known that updates were coming to improve the product - then you'll kill these dodgy updates in their tracks - as it is I'm going to buy 2 and get DVR features based on the hack - which ironically sells 2 more of your boxes..... Some of us just don't want/need to be paying $800+ for a DVR if your $400 one can do the same thing.

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:01 AM
Posted by tivoexpat
01-04-2008, 06:39 PM


Each participant provides some information during registration.
The individual who posted has provided a web address and additional information that provides a reasonable indication of where they are in the food chain (and in which food chain). The use of all caps provides another valuable insight...

TiVo did pretty well with a semi-open approach (they were more open initially and less open later). Frankly, the real money stream/value available in the Freeview market is likely to be services having to do with programming guides and the ability to remotely manage tuning/recording.
With only 4.5 Million Kiwis, the market for hardware will saturate pretty quickly. The hardware/firmware that has reasonable hooks out and in will stand a better chance (past the early adopter phase) if only for their own ability to provide improved services.

Perhaps a useful question would be "Is there any FOSS in the product that is covered by the GPL ?". That way those who are serious about wanting to hack can get on with it. Otherwise, yup, its closed, and the vendor can do what they like (including limiting their market). Those
who have already downloaded firmware can do string searches within the binary to see if it looks like there is FOSS/GPL'd code in it (given that DMCA doesn't apply...).

I wasn't much for hacking my TiVo, but it was nice to know what would be coming out well ahead of time by monitoring the discussions (where do you think TiVo got some of those ideas?).

I've bricked a few devices in my past (iPAQ with Java-SE and JAI was nice, but one upgrade too many...), so my hat's off to those who are experimenting.

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:02 AM
Posted by Apsattv
01-04-2008, 06:46 PM

I wonder if the next step is to Jtag the existing firmware? that way it can be flashed back to virgin.

Its proven all thats holding the box back is the NZ Firmware.

Why is that Mr Capslock?

Who is doing the NZ firmware and where do we send the bugs sugestions and improvements to?

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:02 AM
Posted by Green
01-04-2008, 08:14 PM



Originally Posted by lotech
Awesome job! I love breaking things with hacks.
Have you plugged the drive into a computer yet? What does the file structure and file formats look like? There is a chance the sound could be being recorded - just not able to be played back?

Connected to a PC and no luck yet. I thought it would be FAT32 or EXT3 based on pics in the upgrade guides, but I wasn't presented with the options and an EXT3 reader on XP doesn't seem to see the files.

I've also started to see some problems with the recordings. Last night I only did 3 or so recordings of a couple of seconds each - and they seemed to work. This afternoon however, I recorded for a bit longer and when you try to replay them they cause the box to reset. Not sure if it is a HDD/USB enclosure incompatibility or simply a problem caused by running HK FW on an NZ box.

And of course, it looks like AC3 had been removed from the TV3 feeds, so no audio anyway.

Update: If you manually format the drive as FAT32, then the Zinwell can use it _and_ XP can read it. It stores away .mpg, .nav and .0/.1 files. The mpg files don't appear to be standard files though.

Interestingly, there is a file called 'core' in the root directory - possibly a core dump from when video viewing fails.

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:04 AM
Posted by Transducer
02-04-2008, 04:10 PM

"NEXT will provide technical support, to its nationwide network, for the full range of Zinwell’s products. This support will be managed from the main workshop and head office at Ellerslie under the direction of our Technical Manager, Phil Beel."
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Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:17 AM
Posted by Morristhecat
03-04-2008, 12:09 AM

I've given it a go and here's the result....
with a Zinny.

Using the downloads from

SCHOT

i had to then go through Installation and use the Manual Scan to enter the parameters for NZ

29 538,000MHz 8MHz High
33 570,000MHz 8MHz High
45 666,000MHz 8MHz High

taken from the original Freeview settings. Audio present on all sources. (using the Taiwanese settings and doing Auto Scan tesults in zipnadda because they are for a totally different channel/parameters arrangement).

No problems with the unit realising an external USB 160MB drive but i found i needed i HAD TO unpartition it using Disk Management and then it could be formated on the Zinny.

Serious problems i have though:

1. Confirming NO AUDIO when replaying recordings! Have only checked analogue outputs, perhaps something appears in Coaxial or fibre but somehow i doubt it will.

2. For a recording to work (pictures replay only so far) the EPG must list the program you want to record. Of course with MHEG broken there'll only be the current/next show to chose from. Starting a record loads it into a Recoding List. Doing a 'Crash' record on any show without going via the EPG results in an unplayable file followed (when selecting it under 'File') by a self reboot when attempting to play it. Issues with HDD management perhaps?

At this stage it's obvious the record side needs another software change to allow the Zinny to process the NZ EPG format. A pity but that's the joy of playing with this kind of thing. Maybe it will come.

I'm happy because the Zinny now lets me view channels that are still 'unmodulated' (the TVNZ Reserves) so i know they are "there" and not being blanked as under original FreeviewHD Ver settings. We may even be able to see the prep toward the Olympics perhaps. Weirdly tvCentral appears complete with info but in Auckland it's also showing as Maori TV.

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:21 AM
Posted by Green
03-04-2008, 08:41 AM

morristhecat, Welcome to the voided-warranty club.

I don't think you need to unpartition it if you had it formatted as FAT32 to start off with. (This also makes it trivial to see the files when you connect the HDD to a PC). If you let the Zinwell format the disk, then it will use it's own file system (possibly EXT3, but still to be confirmed).

I've also noticed that the epg guide will cause the unit to crash if you do it too soon after chaning channels - probably because of a lack of data.

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:22 AM
Posted by Morristhecat
03-04-2008, 01:53 PM

Kerpow to the warranty thing...

Yes, i'll spend some more time having a play out of purely academic reasons with a HDD. I think the Zinny would format in Linux EXT3 because of the constraints of a FAT32 which from my memory are a max of 45MB files (but correct me if i'm wrong).

With the EPG broken and not working i'll have to look to the TV Station's website as to what's on. No biggie.

Having no audio during recording replay is a real pity but i'm going to have a really good look into that.

The biggest PLUS is i now have access to all the TVprogram source Channels rather than have them 'muted' as the standard FreeviewHD did and to me that's worth the voided-warranty thing. That means in my eyes the decoder is only partially a brick at the moment and it's begging for more attention.... (oh the challenge) :-)

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:23 AM
Posted by Morristhecat
03-04-2008, 09:32 PM

...More trivia for those who maybe faintly interested
and yes, i've desoldered and carefully pealed off that fat heatsink from the large device thats been making sooo much heat.

On mine its a Broadcom BCM7402. Broadcom rings a bell for me, the Bluetooth system on my notebook was provided by this company. Anyway see:

http://www.broadcom.com/products/Consumer-Electronics/High-Definition-Audio-Video-Graphics-System-Processors/BCM7402

which tells a bit more about the ic and interestingly it says they're a non PVR/DVR so i wonder what the Olevia (that the update firmware was for) has in it. Possibly the reason why the Zinny's EPG doesn't work into recordings and sound is lost doing one... the real-estate is missing on the device?

Oh, i've added a mod, replaced that surface mount happy-LED for a conventional one (the board is all set for one) and used some solvent to 'open a window' on the escutcheon. Bit gay it being blue though but at least i now can see if the unit is powered up and in processing mode or not.

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:24 AM
Posted by Kiwisteve
03-04-2008, 09:44 PM

Is there any easy place to get 5v or 12v DC to run a small Fan ??
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Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:24 AM
Posted by Apsattv
03-04-2008, 11:15 PM

I thought all these units use a 7100 STi Chipset.?

The Zinwell satellite ones use the Sti 5105 chipset.

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:33 AM
Posted by Lotech
04-04-2008, 09:25 AM

Dick Smith has them back at $399, and it would seem like the regular price point.

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:36 AM
Posted by dvhsfan
04-04-2008, 11:19 AM

Just had my STB delivered from Dick Smith ($399)
and have set it up.

There appears to be a problem with the video out options.

On the video output setting - according to the manual -
you can select from AUTO/1080i/720p/576p/576i

However on the onscreen display there is no AUTO option.

This means that you have to set the video output to either 1080i
OR 720p, which of course means that if you set it to 1080i
for TV3 (native) then on switching to TV1 the decoder seems to upscale
the TVNZ 720p signal to 1080i. According to my TV display.

Conversely - if you set the STB to 720p (native for TV1 and 2)
then on switching to TV3 it will downscale their 1080i to
720p!

What's happened to the AUTO option?

Anyone else spotted this?

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:38 AM
Posted by Kiwisteve
04-04-2008, 04:24 PM

Yes thats right TV confirms upscale to 1080 i from the TVNZ and Other channels
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Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:39 AM
Posted by bigbadfun
04-04-2008, 05:04 PM

Yep
Can confirm this too. Weird.

Surely you'd want an auto option so that you can view 720 stuff natively and not upscaled to 1080i (ie: screwed around with) Native would be better huh?

Other weird things... the HD DEMO channel displays the SONY logo then the FULL 1080 logo... but transmission seems to be 720p

"Malcolm in the Middle" seems to be broadcasted in HD 1080i.... but it's in 4:3 aspect....

Man, so confusing??

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:39 AM
Posted by Apsattv
04-04-2008, 05:05 PM

So you have 576i content upscaled By TVNZ to 720P which is then upscaled again to 1080 by the STB? how does that look? it can't be good??

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:42 AM
Posted by Tranceducer
04-04-2008, 05:10 PM

Managed to persuade my manager to give me a work order for one today. I had to explain to the Dick Smith guy what these things actually did.
"You should hook it up to one of those plasma screens over in the corner" I said.

There is a very small green surface mount LED on the board near the power button. You can see it though the vents in the top. It's the only indication that the thing is running when you turn it on. (Apart from the on screen menu and the heat)
It also seems to differ slightly from the demo unit I saw last year in the respect that you only get std a defenition (pal) component output no matter what resolution it is running. The demo units analog out component scaled up along with the HDMI. I remember the display device reporting 1080i with component. This is somthing I wish this model also did as not every display device has HDMI (or DVI) in. And you can turn componenet into RGB if you have the right box. (usefull for those 21" dell crt monitors that were saved from the scrappy)

So we have spent most of the afternoon watching the sony demo's on channel 100. The techs here voted the scenes from Gibraltar with the two loverly lasses frollicing about in the cafe's the best "enhanced"scenes.
Although if you really wanted to please the troops bikini destinations always goes down well (Who do we have to talk to??)
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Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:43 AM
Posted by Bigbadfun
04-04-2008, 05:14 PM

I don't think TVNZ upscale anything do they? At the moment I'm watching Maori TV cooking channel - it's in 4:3 aspect, broadcast at 576i, and being upscaled to 1080i by STB.

Apart from the content being utter rubbish, the picture looks superb.

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:44 AM
Posted by Kiwisteve
04-04-2008, 05:35 PM

tv1 720p
tv2 720p
Tv3 1080i
C4 576i
MTS 576i
tvnz6 576i
tvnz7 576i
Sorts Extra 576i
Parliament 576i
HD Demo 720p

according to On Screen Display
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Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:45 AM
Posted by Apsattv
04-04-2008, 07:40 PM


Originally Posted by BigBadFun
I don't think TVNZ upscale anything do they? At the moment I'm watching Maori TV cooking channel - it's in 4:3 aspect, broadcast at 576i, and being upscaled to 1080i by STB.

Apart from the content being utter rubbish, the picture looks superb.

I'm talking about some shows TVNZ have their tape copy as 576i. Its not Native 720P so its upscaled to 720P for playout on say TV1. How does that look if its upscaled by the STB to output as 1080i?

576i original content scaled twice ?

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:47 AM
Posted by Kiwisteve
04-04-2008, 07:55 PM

You can manually set the box to 720p or 560i if you dont want to go up to 1080i pity it Not Auto
Pix very good even upscaled compared to Satellite
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Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:48 AM
Posted by Green
04-04-2008, 11:15 PM


Originally Posted by Tranceducer
It also seems to differ slightly from the demo unit I saw last year in the respect that you only get std a defenition (pal) component output no matter what resolution it is running. The demo units analog out component scaled up along with the HDMI. I remember the display device reporting 1080i with component. This is somthing I wish this model also did as not every display device has HDMI (or DVI) in. And you can turn componenet into RGB if you have the right box. (usefull for those 21" dell crt monitors that were saved from the scrappy)

It has been shown that this is a 'feature' of the firmware - probably to appease the studios by ensuring that HD content can only be viewed with a secure digital channel. It perhaps isn't advertised very well, but besides an HDMI port you also need to have support for HDCP. Some earlier HDMI capable TV models still won't work correctly because of this.

It is a pity that consumers, and especially early adopters, are being penalized in an effort to battle piracy. (Not to mention the environmental impact of having to replace 2/3 year old 'HD-capable' TVs due to an artificial limitation imposed on STBs).

I can understand SKY decoders requiring HDMI w/HDCP, after all the broadcast medium is encoded and they supply/control the only STBs that are allowed to receive the signal, so the video stream remains encrypted all the way to the TV. But in Freeview's case the signal is broadcast is 'in-the-clear' and it is entirely up to the receiver to honour any ICT flags when outputting to TVs.

It will be interesting when other Freeview certified boxes become available, and to see if they are subject to the same restrictions. (Ie, if it is a Freeview requirement not to output HD over component). If this is the case, then this may make non-certified boxes that do allow HD component output more popular than official boxes.

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:51 AM
Posted by Lompoc42
05-04-2008, 09:10 PM

Good job with the hacks! Can't wait until this all gets figured out. Personally I've really been enjoying the HD broadcasts from 1 2 and 3.

Anyone know if there will eventually be some 1080p broadcasts? Does this box handle 1080p?

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 04:51 AM
Posted by Kiwisteve
05-04-2008, 09:48 PM

As far as I can tell 1080i only no 1080p
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Apsattv
08-05-2008, 07:20 PM
Posted by Bigbadfun
06-04-2008, 09:30 AM

1080p
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I was under the impression that 1080p is just a BluRay disc standard. Broadcasts worldwide are only either 720p or 1080i - no broadcasters transmit 1080p.

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 07:21 PM
Posted by Kiwisteve
06-04-2008, 11:53 AM

I think thats probably correct . I have never seen any mention of 1080p for DVB T only 1080i and below
__________________
DVB T received !

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 07:22 PM
Posted by DTS6.1
06-04-2008, 12:27 PM

I cant get this unit to display on my Panasonic AE500 projector, all I get is static and coloured lines down the left side of the screen (it works fine on my LCD TV), I am using an HDMI to DVI cable which works fine for my DVD player, Also I'm pretty sure that my projector is HDCP compliant... any ideas?

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 07:23 PM
Posted by Kiwisteve
06-04-2008, 01:55 PM

What method of input switching does projector Have Auto or Manual Source switching ?
You might also like to try an HDMI to HDMI cable
__________________
DVB T received !

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 07:23 PM
Posted by DTS6.1
06-04-2008, 04:03 PM


Originally Posted by kiwisteve
What method of input switching does projector Have Auto or Manual Source switching ?
You might also like to try an HDMI to HDMI cable

It has manual input switching, the reason I am using an HDMI to DVI cable is because the projector has a DVI input (no HDMI), which from what I have read is fully compatible with HDMI? also my DVD player which upscales works fine outputing 720p or 1080i with the same cable.
I can get the STB to work on my projector through component but then I'm missing out on HD 720p or 1080i as component only offers SD 576i

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 07:24 PM
Posted by Kiwisteve
06-04-2008, 04:12 PM

Yes correct 720p and 1080i only appears on the HDMI output not on SVHS or Component outputs .
Its most odd that that combonation works on other devices. I wonder if its getting any HDCP blocking or bandwidth issues

Have a look on http://www.dtvforum.info/ and see if there are any postings
on there

In the meantime I will ask a friend with a projector if similar problems

cheers
__________________
DVB T received !

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 07:25 PM
Posted by Tranceducer
07-04-2008, 01:21 PM

Ok,... well this sux!
After trying the G7503-DSE (zinwell) on a few different display devices I have a hunch that you are goin to be sh*t out of luck if the display device is not fully HDCP (High definition content protection) compatible. (I think "dts6.1" you might fall into that category, Yes DVI and HDMI are electronically compatible)
So far I haven't found a device yet that works with the DVI-HDMI adaptor.
This differs once again from the Demo model I used last year on the same professional equipment with the same cables.
The device I plugged into reported the correct outputs (i.e.-PAL, 576i, 720p, 1080i) But there was not picture content.
BIG Brother (SONY distribution etc) Thanks for NIX.
So if I am right about this does it mean that the chance of getting a HD PVR version is slim to nil?

Green; Could you do a bit of research using your modded unit? I see you have got 720p over component so that might be an indication.

I will be around at the time of the official launch of freeview HD. Not necessarily for the actual gig (My invite must have got lost in the mail) but I may be here for the setup. If I can find the right person I may ask a few questions about their position. No promises, I might just get lucky.
__________________
"Oh-Cr*p!"

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 07:26 PM
Posted by B26353
07-04-2008, 11:47 PM

False advertising
Umm so I just plugged in a Zinwell 620HD from Noel Leeming and guess what? I can't get HD. It doesn't say on the box that you only can only get SD unless you have an HDMI cable (not supplied). I wonder how many people get home, plug it in and think they've got HD because the picture looks better than VHF.

If I'd known DSE were selling the same box - with an HDMI cable for $50 less...

And what's the deal with no PVR options. I record everything I watch on a Sony hard disk recorder at the moment (which I'll still need for PrimeTV ).
Tonight - I plugged the zinwell into the Sony via S-video and recorded Bones because my TV3 reception was marginal before - so The Network's plan to force me to watch adverts has been thwarted.

Also there's no 16:9 anamorphic with component output (only letterbox) - if you're watching SD letterbox zoomed up on a widescreen TV you're only really watching 433 visible horizontal lines instead of 576.

And we know that the box is capable of recording to an external USB drive and can output 720p via component from the firmware "upgrades" that have been tried.

Why is it being hobbled?

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 07:27 PM
Posted by Apsattv
08-04-2008, 12:02 AM


Originally Posted by b26354

Also there's no 16:9 anamorphic with component output (only letterbox) - if you're watching SD letterbox zoomed up on a widescreen TV you're only really watching 433 visible horizontal lines instead of 576.

Why is it being hobbled?

are you certain that its letterboxed on the component? surely its matched to whatever your main display output is set at then downscaled?

If the source is 1080i or 720p in 16x9 then surely the dumbed down component output should be standard definition with the flag set?

Why does it take a bunch of "geeks" to notice these things

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 07:28 PM
Posted by b26354
08-04-2008, 12:35 AM



Originally Posted by Apsattv
are you certain that its letterboxed on the component? surely its matched to whatever your main display output is set at then downscaled?

If the source is 1080i or 720p in 16x9 then surely the dumbed down component output should be standard definition with the flag set?

Why does it take a bunch of "geeks" to notice these things

OK my mistake the "pillarbox" setting is 16:9 anamorphic.

The instruction manual "recommends" letterbox as the best option though and has no description of the other modes.

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 07:29 PM
Posted by Kiwisteve
08-04-2008, 08:53 AM

HDMI Cable
Yes you have to shop around for Best Price / HDMI cable supplied with STB .

So far I have found DSE have the best deal and you get a whole dollar
discount with a trade card !!!
__________________
DVB T received !

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 07:30 PM
Posted by DTS6.1
08-04-2008, 11:05 AM



Originally Posted by Tranceducer
After trying the G7503-DSE (zinwell) on a few different display devices I have a hunch that you are goin to be sh*t out of luck if the display device is not fully HDCP (High definition content protection) compatible. (I think "dts6.1" you might fall into that category, Yes DVI and HDMI are electronically compatible)
So far I haven't found a device yet that works with the DVI-HDMI adaptor.
This differs once again from the Demo model I used last year on the same professional equipment with the same cables.
The device I plugged into reported the correct outputs (i.e.-PAL, 576i, 720p, 1080i) But there was not picture content.
BIG Brother (SONY distribution etc) Thanks for NIX.
So if I am right about this does it mean that the chance of getting a HD PVR version is slim to nil?

Green; Could you do a bit of research using your modded unit? I see you have got 720p over component so that might be an indication.

I will be around at the time of the official launch of freeview HD. Not necessarily for the actual gig (My invite must have got lost in the mail) but I may be here for the setup. If I can find the right person I may ask a few questions about their position. No promises, I might just get lucky.

I just got an email back from Panasonic NZ stating that my projector is HDCP compliant, they have also tried a freeview box out on some of their latest HDCP compliant projectors and plasmas via DVI and guess what- it doesn't work! however their latest bluray players do work using the same HDMI to DVI cable! go figure.

There is obviously something dodgy with the G7503-DSE firmware

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 07:30 PM
Posted by Kiwisteve
08-04-2008, 01:36 PM

I Would say all sorts of compatibilty issues are going to turn up .

Does anyone know what was around in way of sets that will do 1080i
and 720p that DO NOT have an HDMI connection ?? so via Component
only !!
__________________
DVB T received !

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 07:31 PM
Posted by Tranceducer
08-04-2008, 03:44 PM


Originally Posted by kiwisteve
I Would say all sorts of compatibilty issues are going to turn up .

Does anyone know what was around in way of sets that will do 1080i
and 720p that DO NOT have an HDMI connection ?? so via Component
only !!

Well none of our 6 or so Panasonic plasmas (and they are all under 3 years old) have HDMI inputs. But that is because we didn't buy HDMI input cards for them at the time of purchase because HDMI is not a professional video format. More of a domestic format.
VGA (RGB multi sync) Component (including progressive component.) DVI or even SDI are the formats we use. This is why i'm a bit p*ssed.
Granted it may not be the same for the domestic user but my point is it depends on the configuration not necessarily the model.
__________________
"Oh-Cr*p!"

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 07:32 PM
Posted by Zombiefood
08-04-2008, 08:46 PM

DTS6.1
the snow is indeed caused by a HDCP issue I have the same issue with my Philips 32ta1000 It would seem the first decoder off the rank is not compatible with DVI tv's

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 07:53 PM
This is where we hit a brickwall in this thread due to the server backup problem these old pages of the thread are missing

http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/dtt-hardware-discussion/304-zinwell-620-hd-7.html

http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/dtt-hardware-discussion/304-zinwell-620-hd-8.html

Posts will continue with data taken from.

http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/dtt-hardware-discussion/304-zinwell-620-hd-9.html

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 07:56 PM
Posted by ZiglioNZ
?, 10:26 AM



Originally Posted by morristhecat
Active device in the Zinny is a BCM7402

Only support i have found so far is:

http://www.lauterbach.com/frames.html?bdmmips.html

Looks all too expensive at this stage.

I'd love to port Java onto this box

You're right, the Lauterbach is one of the most expensive tools. I don't know though if you need Jtag... sometimes gaining access to the serial port pins is enough.
The OpenWRT guys have managed to get it going onto some MIPS devices.
I'd love to play with it but it's too expensive at this stage.

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 07:57 PM
Posted by Morissthecat
?



Originally Posted by Trig
Morristhecat,

I did pm you with what I have done so far, not sure if you have received them. Your help would be appreciated.

Ta

Dave

Adding a Happy LED... sorry about not answering your PMs.
Here are the other things to do.... after removing the surface mount green LED LD4 add a joiner like this:




use LD4 solder pad nearest the front and clear the front escutcheon so the led's light shines through.

Note, the mod probably send you mad later while trying to watch TV if it's too bright but handy to know the Decoders state while you're hacking it on the bench....

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 07:58 PM
Posted by Trigg
? 04:30 PM

Great stuff, job done, not as neat as your example but it works.

Thanks again

Dave.

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 07:59 PM
Posted by Geekster
? 10:59 AM

morristhecat: Any chance of some more pics of the inside of the box?

ZombieFood: It runs embedded Linux? Wow. I think the .zim is more than just a config and appearance file, as the olevia version adds recording and HD-over-component, so unless it's all built into the OS, and the .zim is just telling it to enable and disable various functions, then there's a good chance it has some executable code in it. If we could just make a file that allowed us to access the Linux console directly, then we might be in with a chance. BTW, if its a custom version of linux (which it probably is), then the source code should be floating around somewhere, or at least it should be.

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 08:01 PM
Posted by Geekster
? 12:54 PM

Done a bit of googling, found this pfd. It looks like it can do quite a bit, that wee ol' BCM7402. Heaps of potential there (loving the built-in SATA), although I am worried about the presence of DES, TripleDES, AES, CSS (and a bunch of others), along with the support of ISO7816 smart cards.
__________________
What? Haven't you ever seen someone fix a car with an axe?

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 08:02 PM
Posted by Morristhecat
? 01:26 PM


Originally Posted by Geekster
morristhecat: Any chance of some more pics of the inside of the box?

.


OK will do in next post.... hold on to your seat.....

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 08:03 PM
Posted by Morristhecat
? 01:39 PM


Topside of Zinny board


There are 2 main sets of .01" bump header connects that maybe connecting to the BCM device and are labeled as J9 'BBS':



and as 'Debug Message'. There's a tack switch that does a reboot on the left:



In the powersupply section there's another set of .01" headers, (J11) but these are unlikely to be connects to the BCM...

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 08:03 PM
Posted by Geekster
? 01:49 PM

Hmm
Both headers look interesting. At a guess, the 'Debug messages' one is just a serial port (wiring up an interface shouldn't be too hard, there's heaps of tutorials out there like this one for a PS2, assuming it's a 3.3v port, a 5v one can be wired up directly), but that BBS one has me stumped. I also noticed that there's a few unpopulated pads. Could this mean an upgrade?
__________________
What? Haven't you ever seen someone fix a car with an axe?

Apsattv
08-05-2008, 08:06 PM
This is where we hit the next loss of data with postings from

Pages 10,11,12,13 of the old thread missing.

Unless someone has backups or cached pages in their browsers History?

Please email me if you do. rather than responding to this actual thread.

I will give it 24 hours then let this thread resume.

vinboy
09-05-2008, 03:51 PM
Posted by ZiglioNZ (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/ziglionz.html)

Originally Posted by morristhecat http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/images/ca_evo2/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/dtt-hardware-discussion/304-zinwell-620-hd-post1707.html#post1707) Another thing to try is to set up a record on a large Flash drive, (i've been using a 16GB stick) formatted FAT32. Too many start stop records/plays soon crashes the system so it writes a core dump 12MB file to the stick, named (funny enough CORE). Have a gander at the file with a HEX editor and you'll see all kinds of interesting messages. Perhaps, by doing this one of our Linux gurus will be able to confirm that the BCM7402 is doing things in a Linux fashion....?
Good stuff!
I've found in google a tool that parses linux core dump files:
http://adimitrov.net/main/viewcore/

There's also a link to a whitepaper about dump files:
http://adimitrov.net/main/viewcore/coredump_paper.pdf

It's worth trying... if you want to share the file, I might have a go

vinboy
09-05-2008, 03:52 PM
Posted by Geekster (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/geekster.html)

Originally Posted by morristhecat http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/images/ca_evo2/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/dtt-hardware-discussion/304-zinwell-620-hd-post1706.html#post1706) More trivia...

J9 BBS
>1. +3.3v
2. NO SIGNAL/VOLTS
3. NO SIGNAL/VOLTS
4. GND

Jx Debug
>1. +5V
2. +3.3V
3. NO SIGNAL/VOLTS
4. GND

J11
1. unknown
2. +5V
3. +4.8V
4. unknown
5. (causes a reset) when touching with scope/meter probe
6. GNDWell, there goes my serial port idea (all onboard serial ports I've seen have this config:

1 3.3v
2 3-ish rxd or txd
3 3-ish txd or rxd
4 gnd

Maybe BBS is a serial port, but rxd and txd are disabled somehow in the firmware (or whatever it is). A pin out for the CPU might help explain a bit.

vinboy
09-05-2008, 03:54 PM
Posted by morristhecat (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/morristhecat.html)

More trivia...

(missed this before)...

pin # 2. of 'Jx Debug Message' shows serious amounts of data activity when transitioning from Standby to ON ie during boot. Same occurs when doing a rest with the onboard tack-switch, same data packets. Once on and working the pin settles Hi to +3.3V and silence, silence that is as long as there's an aerial connected and the unit is running.

Any commands from the i/r remote results in a set of ordered data packets as the BCM7402 acknowledges the i/r command followed by a set as the chips does what the remote requested.

Holding the onboard tack switch down and pin #2 goes Lo. Upon release, boot commences but the set of data packets activity is much higher (obviously because of boot) but burried in there is a a probable hail to commence JTAG.... or something.

More playing required....

vinboy
09-05-2008, 03:54 PM
Posted by bartender (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/bartender.html)

The Broadcom Spec sheet can be found here: http://www.broadcom.com/products/Cab...essors/BCM7402 (http://www.broadcom.com/products/Cable/High-Definition-Audio-Video-Graphics-System-Processors/BCM7402)

I know the latest Dreambox DM800 is based upon the BCM7401 which is the PVR version rather than the non-pvr one BCM7402, I would also assume that most of the interfaces are pretty much the same.

These boxes must be running linux, and I will have a look at the firmware from the HK site, would suspect it's a cramfs image or something similar.

What is also good is that "they" have got HE-AAC and MHEG-5 support in there, since HE-AAC wasn't listed on the Broadcom site... now I just need to track down the source.

vinboy
09-05-2008, 03:55 PM
Posted by openmedia (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/openmedia.html)

If they are linux based then some of the stack is proprietary as there isn't stable Linux support for LATM HE-AAC or the H.264 variant freeview is using.

vinboy
09-05-2008, 03:55 PM
Posted by Geekster (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/geekster.html)

Originally Posted by morristhecat http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/images/ca_evo2/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/dtt-hardware-discussion/304-zinwell-620-hd-10.html#post1759) More trivia...

(missed this before)...

pin # 2. of 'Jx Debug Message' shows serious amounts of data activity when transitioning from Standby to ON ie during boot. Same occurs when doing a rest with the onboard tack-switch, same data packets. Once on and working the pin settles Hi to +3.3V and silence, silence that is as long as there's an aerial connected and the unit is running.

Any commands from the i/r remote results in a set of ordered data packets as the BCM7402 acknowledges the i/r command followed by a set as the chips does what the remote requested.

Holding the onboard tack switch down and pin #2 goes Lo. Upon release, boot commences but the set of data packets activity is much higher (obviously because of boot) but burried in there is a a probable hail to commence JTAG.... or something.

More playing required....
It's alive! It seems pin 2 is TxD, and pin 3 is RxD. There's a chance it's still a serial port (I'm not that knowledgeable about JTAG, so to me it seems like a serial port). Any chance you could log this data? A MAX2xx series chip could do it (free samples from the maxim site www.maxim-ic.com (http://www.maxim-ic.com/), try the MAX235MDG+ or similar, sorry if this sounds like an ad).

vinboy
09-05-2008, 03:55 PM
Posted by bartender (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/bartender.html)

And from a brief look at the downloaded firmware it's a squashfs filesystem from the sqsh at offset 0x30 in the file.

Seems to have a few headers and footers on the file for CRC/file validation.

But down the end of the file it has references to bcmdriver.ko, settop, zwm_base_zinwell so will try unsquashing the file and see what I can see.

And if it has a serial out, why bother with the Max232, just connect it up to your PC, try it at the common baud rates (9600, 19200, 38400) and see what comes through! Doubt you would get a shell prompt, but it may give you more of an idea whats happening when booting.

vinboy
09-05-2008, 03:56 PM
Posted by Geekster (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/geekster.html)
Only problem with that: STB serial port runs at 3.3v, PC's serial ports run at 5v.

vinboy
09-05-2008, 03:56 PM
Posted by Geekster (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/geekster.html)


Originally Posted by bartender http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/images/ca_evo2/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/dtt-hardware-discussion/304-zinwell-620-hd-10.html#post1770) But down the end of the file it has references to bcmdriver.ko, settop, zwm_base_zinwell so will try unsquashing the file and see what I can see.
Any luck unsquashing it yet?

Edit: On doing a bit of research, it seems we can be sure that the CPU runs embedded Linux, as squashfs is for Linux only. If we mount the image, we could dissect it and hack it somewhat. It depends if the image includes the OS

vinboy
09-05-2008, 03:56 PM
Posted by Geekster (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/geekster.html)

Found this here (http://www.zintech.com.tw/product/STB/DVB-T_Digital_Terrestrial.html)
System Resources

CPU - 450 DMIPS
DDR - 128MB DDR
Flash Memory - 8 MB
That's heaps to play with.

vinboy
09-05-2008, 03:57 PM
Posted by morristhecat (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/morristhecat.html)
So, has anyone found anything further yet?

vinboy
09-05-2008, 03:57 PM
Posted by Green (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/green.html)

Originally Posted by morristhecat http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/images/ca_evo2/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/dtt-hardware-discussion/304-zinwell-620-hd-post1706.html#post1706) Jx Debug
>1. +5V
2. +3.3V
3. NO SIGNAL/VOLTS
4. GNDHere's a cable that can do what you're after (after moving some of the pins around to suit the pinout) http://www.ftdichip.com/Documents/Da...TTL232R3V3.pdf (http://www.ftdichip.com/Documents/DataSheets/Modules/DS_TTL232R3V3.pdf)

2. Tx (Tx from the Zinwell)
3. Rx (Tx from the PC)

115200, 8, N, 1

Log is attached to post. (confirms the use of squashfs)

vinboy
09-05-2008, 03:58 PM
Posted by Green (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/green.html)
Part of the log is the following string:

"started: BusyBox v1.2.1 (2008.01.11-08:29+0000) multi-call binary"

Doing a quick google on BusyBox, and you find their license agreement


BusyBox is licensed under the GNU General Public License version 2, which is often abbreviated as GPLv2. (This is the same license the Linux kernel is under, so you may be somewhat familiar with it by now.)

A complete copy of the license text is included in the file LICENSE in the BusyBox source code.

Anyone thinking of shipping BusyBox as part of a product should be familiar with the licensing terms under which they are allowed to use and distribute BusyBox. Read the full text of the GPL (either through the above link, or in the file LICENSE in the busybox tarball), and also read the Frequently Asked Questions about the GPL.

Basically, if you distribute GPL software the license requires that you also distribute the source code to that GPL-licensed software. So if you distribute BusyBox without making the source code to the version you distribute available, you violate the license terms, and thus infringe on the copyrights of BusyBox. (This requirement applies whether or not you modified BusyBox; either way the license terms still apply to you.) Read the license text for the details.

vinboy
09-05-2008, 03:59 PM
Posted by openmedia (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/openmedia.html)
Ok someone want to request a copy of all Open Source used on the STB. We have sufficient evidence that they are atleast using Busy Box.

I'd recommend trying via Next as well as directly with Zinwell.

http://www.nextelectronics.co.nz/zinwell.shtml
http://www.zinwell.com.tw/

vinboy
09-05-2008, 03:59 PM
Posted by Green (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/green.html)
LOL. This is just too funny. I played around with it a bit, looking at the debug output when I do stuff in the menu etc. Then I tried looking at the epg - which sometimes crashes on the HK firmware. And this is what I got:


get HD ws.dx = 0, ws.dy = 0, ws.dw = 1280, ws.dx = 720
resize HD ws.dx = 856, ws.dy = 104, ws.dw = 402, ws.dx = 192
get ws.dx = 0, ws.dy = 0, ws.dw = 720, ws.dx = 576
resize ws.dx = 482, ws.dy = 84, ws.dw = 226, ws.dx = 158
uiNoOfChanAvailable = 17
CHKCHNAVL: before display channum: 4
signal 10
return to default handler
Killed
ls: /mnt/usb/core*.*: No such file or directory
umount: Couldn't umount /mnt/usb: Invalid argument
Starting pid 300, console /dev/ttyS0: '/bin/ash'


BusyBox v1.2.1 (2008.01.11-08:29+0000) Built-in shell (ash)
Enter 'help' for a list of built-in commands.

# help

Built-in commands:
-------------------
. : break cd chdir continue eval exec exit export false hash
help local pwd read readonly return set shift source times trap
true type ulimit umask unset wait

#
w00t! Console access

vinboy
09-05-2008, 04:00 PM
Posted by Green (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/green.html)
Another command prompt, this time in what appears to be the Common Firmware Environment (CFE)(?).

It looks like all you need to do is hit Control-C at the right time during the boot process.


Common Firmware Environment (CFE) version 1.2 for BCM97401C1, (Little Endian Mod
e)
Build Date: Wed Jan 16 08:41:10 2008 (yhchen@yhchen)
Copyright (C) 2000-2007 Broadcom Corporation.

Initializing Arena.
Initializing Devices.
blocks 0 8 8192
blocks 1 127 65536
CPU speed: 297MHz
Total memory: 0x8000000 bytes (128MB)

Total memory used by CFE: 0x80800000 - 0x808F8820 (1017888)
Initialized Data: 0x8089B8C0 - 0x808AA360 (60064)
BSS Area: 0x808AA360 - 0x808F8820 (320704)
Local Heap: 0x808F88A0 - 0x809F88A0 (1048576)
Stack Area: 0x809F88A0 - 0x809FA8A0 (8192)
Text (code) segment: 0x80800000 - 0x80826E30 (159280)

[BTM] CFE Init 0
Automatic startup canceled via Ctrl-C
SSU> ?
Invalid command: "?"
Available commands: set, loop, macprog, flash, memtest, f, e, d, u, wcfe, ramtes
t2, ramtest, copyclone, addclone, lzmaboot, autoboot, batch, go, boot, load, sav
e, ping, arp, ifconfig, sleep, waitusb, show, unsetenv, printenv, setenv, help

*** command status = -1
SSU>

vinboy
09-05-2008, 04:00 PM
Posted by openmedia (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/openmedia.html)
Wow.. Quite an uptodate build of BusyBox

vinboy
09-05-2008, 04:00 PM
Posted by openmedia (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/openmedia.html)
Ok it looks like they are probably running the windriver linux environment - http://www.takefive.com/products/bsp...sort=5&order=2 (http://www.takefive.com/products/bsp_web/bsp_platform.html?platform=Wind+River+Platform+For +Consumer+Devices+Linux+Edition+1.5&sort=5&order=2)

vinboy
09-05-2008, 04:00 PM
Posted by openmedia (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/openmedia.html)
Another link - http://www.windriver.com/products/pr...es-le-Note.pdf (http://www.windriver.com/products/product-notes/Platform-for-Consumer-Devices-le-Note.pdf)

vinboy
09-05-2008, 04:01 PM
Posted by Apsattv (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/apsattv.html)
Great stuff guys is it time to splinter this off into its own thread?

vinboy
09-05-2008, 04:02 PM
Posted by Geekster (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/geekster.html)
Now that is just too cool! So, we have established that Zinwell are violating the GNU GPL (at least with BusyBox if not with the whole Linux environment).
They are using Linux version 2.6.12-4.2-brcmstb build version 2612-4.2, so it's obvious they've customized it alot (at least for the MPEG4 support, if not more).
It is using squashfs.
This is quite funny: bcmdriver: module license 'Proprietary' taints kernel. Oh how true.
This is... interesting: boot time till here (pvr init done) 0. So it has the PVR stuff built into it, we just have to figure out how to enable it.
What the hell? modprobe: failed to load module cdrom They forgot to take out the CD ROM stuff from the kernel? Could some code be put in here?

This is friggin Christmas for me! Woo!

EDIT: I've sent an email to the guys at BusyBox informing them of this. Will let you know if I hear anything from them.

vinboy
09-05-2008, 04:02 PM
Post by openmedia (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/openmedia.html)
Geekster - they are only violating the GPL if the don't supply the source code upon request from a customer. Have you asked for the code yet?

vinboy
09-05-2008, 04:03 PM
Posted by Geekster (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/geekster.html)
Oo crap. Didn't know that, haven't asked, will.
Edit: Just realized: I'm not a customer (I don't own a box). Bugger!
Another edit: I've sent them an email anyway, will let you know if anything happens.

vinboy
09-05-2008, 04:04 PM
Posted by Green (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/green.html)



Originally Posted by Geekster http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/images/ca_evo2/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/dtt-hardware-discussion/304-zinwell-620-hd-12.html#post1876) They are using Linux version 2.6.12-4.2-brcmstb build version 2612-4.2, so it's obvious they've customized it alot (at least for the MPEG4 support, if not more).
Although they might have customized the kernel, this doesn't imply that all of a sudden they have to release everything. I believe that most of the box' functionality derives from an application running on the OS. If they have done due dilligence, then the MPEG4 stuff could simply be encapsulated in the app. As long as the app isn't using GPL'ed code that also requires source code distribution, then they would be OK. They could give us the source for the OS, thereby satisfying the GPL license requirement, but still hang on to the crown jewels.

vinboy
09-05-2008, 04:04 PM
Posted by Geekster (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/geekster.html)
Bugger. We'll see what eventuates. Haven't gotten any replies from either the BusyBox team or Zinwell yet.

vinboy
09-05-2008, 04:04 PM
Posted by LennonNZ (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/lennonnz.html)
I also have requested the source code of any GPL based code they have used in the hardware. As far as I know they have to supply all source code for and GPL software they use (including the linux kernel) up to the point that it has to be able to be compiled

I couldn't find much contacts on the website, but all I did I emailed.
If we get nothing from them then there is then there is
http://www.gpl-violations.org/

It has quite alot of info with what GPL means and what has to be supplied.

vinboy
09-05-2008, 04:05 PM
Posted by morristhecat (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/morristhecat.html)
So, last weekend i cobbled up a 232 i/o onto the debug connect and used Putty to capture the boot reports from both a Standard unit and one flashed with the Olevia PVR mod. Certainly interesting to see why the EPG is lunched now on the PVR's one....

Crtl-C break gets me into the CFE and certainly looks like all sorts of commands are available after asking 'help'...

vinboy
09-05-2008, 04:05 PM
Posted by Rose (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/rose.html)
What about MPEG audio?
[quote=Green;1371]If there is a FreeView hell, then I think I've just reserved my spot.
AAC audio is not recorded. TV3 will play back fine with AC3, but other channel recordings appear to be silent.

Do the radio channels record and play back - they are good old MPEG II....

vinboy
09-05-2008, 04:05 PM
Posted by LennonNZ (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/lennonnz.html)
If someone wants a convertor they can be gotten from http://www.compsys1.com/workbench/On...3_adapter.html (http://www.compsys1.com/workbench/On_top_of_the_Bench/Max233_Adapter/max233_adapter.html)

Or I have one around someplace at home.. but no STB

vinboy
09-05-2008, 04:06 PM
Posted by Green (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/green.html)

Crtl-C break gets me into the CFE and certainly looks like all sorts of commands are available after asking 'help'...

Broadcom CFE related downloads:http://www.broadcom.com/products/com..._downloads.php (http://www.broadcom.com/products/communications_processors_downloads.php)
An interesting functional spec: http://melbourne.wireless.org.au/files/wrt54/cfe.pdf

Most of the time when the unit crashes , it causes a reboot. There are several cases where the main app will crash, but the box doesn't reboot. In these cases you are presented with a full root console shell. (The epg, and playback of video seem like good candidates for generating these 'good' crashes)

If required, the main app/shell can be restarted using the following command:


# cd /mnt/hd
# ./settop zmw_base_zinwell
settop is just a script file, the actual executable is zmw_base_zinwell (And that's the part we're unlikely to see in any GPL-related fishing expeditions, unless we can find GPL stuff inside this binary)

Just for fun, I'm attaching a complete directory listing of the files on the unit, and here's a listing of the processes (zmw_base_zinwell has crashed at this point of course)


# ps
PID PORT STAT SIZE SHARED %CPU COMMAND
1 S 0K 0K 7.8 init
2 S 0K 0K 0.0 ksoftirqd/0
3 S 0K 0K 0.0 events/0
4 S 0K 0K 0.0 khelper
5 S 0K 0K 0.0 kthread
6 S 0K 0K 0.0 kblockd/0
8 S 0K 0K 0.0 pdflush
7 S 0K 0K 0.0 khubd
9 S 0K 0K 0.0 pdflush
11 S 0K 0K 0.0 aio/0
10 S 0K 0K 0.0 kswapd0
12 S 0K 0K 0.0 bcmemacd
13 S 0K 0K 3.9 mtdblockd
14 S 0K 0K 0.0 pegasus
67 S 0K 0K 0.0 scsi_eh_0
68 S 0K 0K 0.0 usb-storage
80 S0 S 0K 0K 0.0 /bin/ash
81 S0 R 0K 0K 0.0 ps
#

Note: no mention of any Ethernet/IP related processes or files. The only place where networking seems to be referenced is in the CFE.

Finally on the GPL front, here (http://www.gnu.org/licenses/old-licenses/gpl-2.0-faq.html) is an interesting read about GPL Licenses (in this case v2 of the license). From what I read, assuming that there is some GPL'ed code covered by GPL 2.0 distributed in the box, then the source code should have been distributed along with it. It is permissible to simply include a written offer of the source instead - but to my knowledge this wasn't present in the box either. The source code should be made available to all third parties so, Geekster, it shouldn't matter if you are the owner of the box or not. But, IANAL, so have a read for yourself - I may be misinterpreting something here.

[Rose - I'll try playing around with recording some radio stuff tomorrow, unless someone else beats me to it]

vinboy
09-05-2008, 04:07 PM
Posted by Apsattv (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/apsattv.html)
Would it be possible to create a "corrupt" video file on those machines that have the Olevia firmware. To inject a hack of some type?

I'm not up with this linux stuff but its very fascinating what has been found so far.

A prize for the 1st person to get it to boot up showing a penguin ;)

vinboy
09-05-2008, 04:07 PM
Posted by Green (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/green.html)
I think that's what I've done tonight (the corrupt video thing, not the penguin) but it's hard to tell. Sometimes the box will 'freeze' first time around, but then it will take ages before it will do it again - so it's hard to tell if the freeze occurred because of the recorded video, or randomness. My current USB stick currently holds 3 very short (<8s) recordings which seems to do the trick. The app crashes with a Signal 10 (bus error, possibly a data alignment issue), which doesn't cause a full reboot.

I don't think it should be too hard to get the OS to the point where it mounts the USB stick. It mounts it automatically as part of normal operation, but the settop script performs a umount on it again after it crashes. Assuming you can remount the usb device, then it should be a trivial operation to run arbitrary code off it. The trickier task will be to find the appropriate tool chain I think.

If you get all of that sorted out, then a 'Hello World' app might be possible.

vinboy
09-05-2008, 04:07 PM
Posted by morristhecat (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/morristhecat.html)
Lets re-define things here: On my Olevia flashed Zinny NO AAC (HE AAC) audio plays back after making a recording from any TV station. Mounting the clip with Media Player123 on my pooter and its still quiet...

The MPEG audio from either the two radio sources does not play back via the Zinny but MediaPlayer123 extracts it fine...

I can confirm as fact the transmitted audio from all TV stations is officially 'MPEG HE-AAC'.

vinboy
09-05-2008, 04:08 PM
Posted by Geekster (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/geekster.html)

Originally Posted by Apsattv http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/dtt-hardware-discussion/304-zinwell-620-hd-13.html#post1909)
Would it be possible to create a "corrupt" video file on those machines that have the Olevia firmware. To inject a hack of some type?

I'm not up with this linux stuff but its very fascinating what has been found so far.

A prize for the 1st person to get it to boot up showing a penguin ;)


I don't know much about Linux, but I don't think the corrupt video stuff is required (can anyone confirm this? Can you run Linux apps off the USB stick?).

As for Tux, well, just make a script that, on bootup, shows him in all his penguinny goodness. Hmm, I wonder if they left JPEG support in the kernel, or would a conversion to ASCII art be required?

In /dev there are a few interesting things, namely: bcmdebug (debug mode/script?), bcmgraphics_0, bcmgraphics_1 (could tux be in here? could this be for menu images and stuff?), bcmremote_a, bcmremote_b (a second remote?), bcmsettopapi (an API? could this be used somehow?), and in /etc: passwd (could someone share the hash in this file?), and I could go on. Now, if only I had a box...

BTW, still haven't heard anything from either BusyBox or Zinwell.

Edit: I've just sent an email to Freeview, to see if they have anything to say on the matter. The following is what I sent them:

Hi. At Zinwell 620 HD (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/dtt-hardware-discussion/304-zinwell-620-hd-11.html) , it has been found that the Zinwell 620-HD Set-top box contains a program (BusyBox), that is under the GNU GPL version 2 license, which Zinwell have been found to be violating by not supplying any source code, or written offer thereof. After contacting Zinwell directly, the silence is deafening. Do you have any comment on this? Thanks.

vinboy
09-05-2008, 04:08 PM
Posted by davisonja (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/davisonja.html)

Originally Posted by Apsattv http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/dtt-hardware-discussion/304-zinwell-620-hd-13.html#post1909)
A prize for the 1st person to get it to boot up showing a penguin ;)

Nah, a chocolate fish to the one who contrives a way of reflashing with the standard Freeview image. Bonus points for a method that doesn't require hardware mods :)

vinboy
09-05-2008, 04:09 PM
Posted by LennonNZ (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/members/lennonnz.html)

Originally Posted by davisonja http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.dtvforum.co.nz/forum/dtt-hardware-discussion/304-zinwell-620-hd-13.html#post1933)
Nah, a chocolate fish to the one who contrives a way of reflashing with the standard Freeview image. Bonus points for a method that doesn't require hardware mods :)

Where can you get the standard freeview image from ??

There are scripts to reflash on the box which can use TFTP to get the image.. (stbutil)

Thanks

Apsattv
09-05-2008, 07:01 PM
Thread now resumes please continue posting.

kenj
09-05-2008, 07:53 PM
How about a chocolate fish for the workers who must have burned the midnight oil to get the site up and running, - Thanks guys

Ken :)

LennonNZ
10-05-2008, 09:16 AM
I've not head back from Zinwell about the GPL'ed stuff. Maybe I try a few more email addresses there..

Green
12-05-2008, 12:18 AM
In the last week or so I have been staring at the bytes contained in the .zim files stored at www.schot.com (which has serious issues when I try to browse to it at the moment) and determined most of how it all fits together.

All fields Big-Endian unless otherwise stated

Header

DWORD dwChecksum // algorithm unknown
WORD wCustomerNumber // probably Little Endian
WORD wNumBlocks // See defn of 'block' later
DWORD dwTotalFileLen
DWORD dwBlockStartLoc[wNumBlocks] // Offsets front start of file

Block

CHAR name[4] // 'ROOT', 'CODE', 'VERI', 'BOXI', 'KERN' ('LOAD','NVRM' ?)
DWORD dwDataLength
DWORD reserved[2] // zero-filled
CHAR blockSignature[4] // 'B','S', 0x00, 0x00
DWORD dwChecksum // algorithm unknown
BYTE data[dwDataLength] // The actual data associated with this block

Special cases for Block.data

The 'VERI' block contains additional verification data for all the blocks in the file. It contains (Block.dwDataLength / 32) entries, where each entry has the following format:


CHAR blockName[4] // 'ROOT', 'CODE', 'KERN' have been observed here
BYTE version_d
BYTE version_c
BYTE version_b
BYTE version_a // version = a.b.d (c never appears to be reported)
DWORD reserved[2] // 0xFF filled
BYTE md5Digest[16] // Calculated on the relevant Block.data

The 'BOXI' block contains 'BoxInformation' in Block.data. All fields in this structure are Little Endian.


WORD uiOUI
WORD reserved[3] // 0x00 filled
WORD wHwVersion*
WORD wSwVersion
WORD wHwModel*
WORD wSwModel*
BYTE abStarterMD5Digest[16]
DWORD uiStarterImageSize

* wHwVersion, wHwModel, wSwModel may not be in the correct location - all fields have identical values at this stage

The 'ROOT' and 'CODE' Block.data contain a squashfs file system (unverified beyond the presence of the squashfs signatures 'hsqs' and 'shsq'). The 'KERN' block is probably just a 'RAW' format.

Analysis of existing firmware updates

Based on the findings above, it is somewhat interesting to go back through the old firmware files and see what they contained (as far as actual data content goes).


(Block, version, size, file system)

Olevia_V1_0_2 with font.zim
ROOT 1.0.2 0x00166000 hsqs(zlib)
CODE 1.0.2 0x001BE000 hsqs(zlib)

Olevia1.1.2.zim
ROOT 1.1.2 0x0024C000 hsqs(zlib)
CODE 1.1.2 0x001B5000 hsqs(zlib)

OleviaPVR_1.2.2_part1.zim
KERN 1.1.0 0x0016C70C
ROOT 1.2.0 0x00080000 shsq(lzma)
CODE 1.2.2 0x001A5000 shsq(lzma)
BOXI 0x00000024

OleviaPVR_1.2.2_part2.zim
ROOT 1.2.0 0x00277000 shsq(lzma)
BOXI 0x00000024

OleviaPVR_1.2.3.zim
CODE 1.2.3 0x001A7000 shsq(lzma)
BOXI 0x00000024

OleviaPVR_1.2.4.zim
CODE 1.2.4 0x001A7000 shsq(lzma)
BOXI 0x00000024

OleviaPVR_1.3.8.zim
CODE 1.3.8 0x001B9000 shsq(lzma)
BOXI 0x00000024

OleviaPVR_1.3.9.zim
CODE 1.3.9 0x001B9000 shsq(lzma)
BOXI 0x00000024

It is now clear to see that in OleviaPVR_1.2.2_part1.zim, the squashfs partitions were changed from the default zlib implementation to the newer, more compressed lzma scheme.

Not shown above is the fact that Header.customerNumber changes from 0x0005 to 0x0105 between 1.2.2 part 1 and 1.2.2 part 2. This appears to be a Little Endian value (incremented by 1), however during upgrades it is displayed to the console in Big Endian format. I have confirmed that there is a check against this number during the upgrade process to prevent the 'hypothetical' upgrade of a Freeview device with Hong Kong firmware - so it is interesting to still see that this was possible (it is possible that Zinwell simply forgot to change the customer number for the NZ builds).

Another interesting tidbit is the fact that all the BOXI blocks appear to contain the same data - however the checksum of this block for 1.3.8 and 1.3.9 is one different to the checksum for 1.2.2 through 1.2.4. Bug - or does the checksum system incorporate part of the version number into it? [edit - actually, there is a change in the data which I didn't originally spot]

It looks like with a bit of effort it should be possible to reverse engineer the checksum algorithm. The upgrade process outputs the expected checksum as well as the calculated checksum to the console. This allows us to inject deliberate bit errors into the firmware image and see what result it has on the calculated checksum.

Flash Layout

From the Common Firmware Environment (CFE) it is possible to list the partitions of the flash0 device


flash0.avail0 New CFI flash at 1E000000 offset 00000000 size 3584KB
flash0.rootfs New CFI flash at 1E000000 offset 00380000 size 512KB
flash0.cfe New CFI flash at 1E000000 offset 00400000 size 320KB
flash0.app New CFI flash at 1E000000 offset 00450000 size 2048KB
flash0.kernel New CFI flash at 1E000000 offset 00650000 size 1664KB
flash0.skip New CFI flash at 1E000000 offset 007F0000 size 62KB
flash0.macadr New CFI flash at 1E000000 offset 007FF800 size 1KB
flash0.nvram New CFI flash at 1E000000 offset 007FF890 size 2KB

As a rough guess, the following firmware block to partition mappings are used

KERN --> flash0.kernel
ROOT --> flash0.rootfs
CODE --> flash0.app

This fits with the sizes of the blocks of most of the firmwares. One notable exception is 1.2.2 part 2, where ~2.5MB is written to rootfs, which is only supposed to be 512kB. I'm not too sure what to make of this contradiction at the moment, and is still a bit of a head scratcher.

PS. Kudos to all for putting in the effort and resurrecting this thread!

Geekster
13-05-2008, 10:42 AM
Holy crap! Nice one Green! How have you been doing all of this? Have you found an emulator for the CPU?

Green
13-05-2008, 11:32 PM
No emulator or anything, just a lot of patience.


I've been playing around with Ubuntu - it has built in support for mksquashfs which could be useful.
010Editor is also great for this sort of work - it has a built in templating language that helps out when trying to figure out the format of files like this.
Some values can be observed in the console output either during the boot sequence or during an upgrade (you can reinstall the same firmware multiple times). This was good for figuring out if unknown items in the .zim were checksums or not.
Flipping bits and then seeing what the upgrade process baulks at also helps
The upgrade process is done by the zinwell app. Copying the app off and looking at the strings it contains (and more importantly, some of the error messages) gives you an idea of what values get cross checked during firmware updates.


Tip 1: Typically, when the zinwell UI app crashes the USB device will automatically be unmounted. You can remount it with the following command: "mount -t vfat /dev/sda1 /mnt/usb" and then it's relatively straight-forward to copy files to the USB device (or in theory to run apps off it)
Tip 2: It can be boring playing around with the command prompt and not being able to watch HD TV at the same time. To fix this, run zmw_base_zinwell but finish the command with an ampersand at the end of the line ('&'). This will run the app in the background and you still have access to the command prompt (albeit with a very slow response time)

Geekster
16-05-2008, 11:52 AM
Hey green, when you're in the console, what's displayed on the tv screen? And have you tried loading a window manager? Imagine that...

Green
16-05-2008, 08:41 PM
Typically you get into the console by crashing the UI app. The screen then freezes at whatever was up at the time. If you restart the UI with an ampersand at the end of the command then the app runs 'in the background' and you get normal STB operation as well as (slow) console access over the serial port.

Green
18-05-2008, 12:10 AM
The checksums use a buggy Adler32 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adler-32) algorithm - the code is correct, but one of the variables is not correctly initialized to 1. This results in the lower 16 bits being off by 1 and the upper 16 normally looking completely different.

The 'main' checksum is easily calculated using this method by simply skipping the first 4 bytes in the file (ie the checksum) and then running the algorithm over the rest of the data.

The checksums in the 'block' structure mentioned in an earlier post is a little bit more complicated. First run the algorithm over the 'data' associated with the block, but then skip back to the start of the block structure and continue up to, but not including, the checksum. (It sounds quite convoluted, but it isn't really that bad).

I've attached some sample code to illustrate how it all fits together.

Rose
18-05-2008, 09:54 AM
I read somewhere that the zinwell can accept over the air firmware updates, my box hasnt changed its reported version since I bought it, so I dont think any have been sent - has anyone got close to being able to capture one of these updates for analysis?

kiwisteve
18-05-2008, 10:15 AM
What SW version and release date do you have ??

To View : Main Menu / System / Information

kiwisteve
18-05-2008, 10:35 AM
Has anyone noticed the Info Bar goes to sleep overnight ?? The times / prog info stop updating . So far I have only noticed it if you leave the STB on TV3
It can be reactived by going to Standby and Restarting

:_applauso::_applauso::_applauso::_applauso:

LennonNZ
18-05-2008, 04:34 PM
Has anyone had any reply from ziwell (or anyone) yet about them releasing the GPL source code yet which they legally have to? I have emailed them (to many email addresses at zinwell) 2 times already without any reply.

Maybe I should contact DSE and ask them for a contact at zinwell who can help me.

Anyone else hear anything yet?

BigAl
18-05-2008, 07:15 PM
What SW version and release date do you have ??

To View : Main Menu / System / Information

my dse box says

h/w version freeview NZ-HD
s/w version 0.12.7
relase time feb 22 2008 09:56:17
ssu info K:0.4.0 R:00.4.0 A 0.12.7 SSu 3
boxinfro OUI 0x59e h/w model 2 h/w version 1
s/w model 1 s/w version 256

BigAl
18-05-2008, 07:17 PM
Has anyone noticed the Info Bar goes to sleep overnight ?? The times / prog info stop updating . So far I have only noticed it if you leave the STB on TV3
It can be reactived by going to Standby and Restarting

:_applauso::_applauso::_applauso::_applauso:

i notice that too
but its on all channels

and on epg (whats on now) goes back to lunch time monday

kiwisteve
18-05-2008, 07:20 PM
Yes that looks to be the latest release

I have noticed a few errors in the menu whould could be
fixed during an update

Geekster
19-05-2008, 01:26 PM
Has anyone had any reply from ziwell (or anyone) yet about them releasing the GPL source code yet which they legally have to? I have emailed them (to many email addresses at zinwell) 2 times already without any reply.

Maybe I should contact DSE and ask them for a contact at zinwell who can help me.

Anyone else hear anything yet?

Me neither. Not from BusyBox, Zinwell or Freeview. Maybe it had something to do with the server crash of '08.

LennonNZ
19-05-2008, 02:32 PM
Looking on the DSE webpage they have 2 DVB-T units

DSE HD Terrestrial Receiver DSE-620 ($399)
and
Zinwell HD DVB-T Receiver ($498)

They both have the same front except it doesn't say Zinwell on the left hand side
So whats the difference?

Or are they the same Zinwell 620HD ? and just on the website to confuse ppl?

LennonNZ
19-05-2008, 02:41 PM
I have contacted DSE now about the firmware which contains GPL based software.

Maybe Zinwell (and other people) ignoring requests at the moment show they don't want to give it (which they legally have to)

Or

maybe grahamw who posted a while ago about the zinwell equipment want to comment or tell us who we can contact?

Rose
19-05-2008, 10:04 PM
I have noticed a few errors in the menu whould could be
fixed during an update

My box from DSE is running 12.7 as well

I have noticed a few bugs over the last few weeks - how many have seen/heard the following?:

The info bar getting locked into history mode
The tiny little gaps in the audio
The video freezing up, while the audio keeps going

Any other bugs anyone else hopes will get fixed???

Apsattv
20-05-2008, 01:00 AM
Just a question as I've yet to see one of these down here in Nelson. Does the Zinwell i.d which transmitter site the signal is from?

Surely some data is sent saying which site is transmitting the signal?

kiwisteve
20-05-2008, 11:50 AM
No
You cant tell if you are on WTE or KKU here , same channel numbers .
In fact if its set on one and move box to the other area it goes straight away, no rescan !!

MorriTheCat
20-05-2008, 09:23 PM
My box from DSE is running 12.7 as well

I have noticed a few bugs over the last few weeks - how many have seen/heard the following?:

The info bar getting locked into history mode
The tiny little gaps in the audio
The video freezing up, while the audio keeps going

Any other bugs anyone else hopes will get fixed???

A little birdy has told me to expect an OTA update to sort the Audio mute ~ Video restart issues and a few other things. Lookout for V1.0.6

Just when i've no idea though....

Injuised
20-05-2008, 10:35 PM
Is that like the zinwell DVBS fix for the noise on the RF that we were promised over a year ago now...

Apsattv
20-05-2008, 10:50 PM
A little birdy has told me to expect an OTA update to sort the Audio mute ~ Video restart issues and a few other things. Lookout for V1.0.6

Just when i've no idea though....

Can confirm there is a new firmware for the Zinwell in testing at the moment. Ignore the version in the doc below

:non sono stato io:

Release Date:
Apr, 16, 2008
Version 1.0.5 Release

Hardware Platforms and Versions Supported:
BCM7402
TVNZ-1.0.5

Software Deliverables:
Description
Filename
Application image
TVNZ_1.0.5.sqsh
Loader image
None

Documentation Deliverables:
Description
Filename
Software Release Note
TVNZ-Software 1.0.5 Release Note.doc
SQA Check Item List Report

SQA Bug Report


Software functions

Known bugs fixed
Request from Freeview: Change words from “Audio Output” to “SPDIF Output” and the default setting from “Mpeg” to “Dolby”.
Request from Freeview: Change words of Aspect ratio.
"Letter Box" -> "4:3 Letter Box"
"Crop" -> "4:3 Centre Cut"
"Pillar Box" -> "16:9 Widescreen"
"AFD Letter Box" -> "AFD 4:3 Letter Box"
"AFD Crop" -> "AFD 4:3 Centre Cut"
"AFD Pillar Box" -> "AFD 16:9 Widescreen"
Request From Freeview: We change DVB subtitle from “On/Off” to “Language selection”
Audio drop issue:
Normally audio_pts and audio_stc have 6000 different, but since s/w use wrong formula calculation, it cause the difference become huge when audio_pts and audio_stc increasing from 0x0fffffff to 0x10000000 (the different will be 0x0fffffff, not 0x00000001) etc.
When s/w detect the huge different will call “audio decode” to sync back. The synchronize process cause audio drop for 1~2s. This is a rarely case to cause the problem and we can only reproduce it on Freeview_dvb_t_SUB_11_2_08.ts provided from Freeview.

MorriTheCat
20-05-2008, 10:52 PM
Is that like the zinwell DVBS fix for the noise on the RF that we were promised over a year ago now...


No nothing like it... the DTT Zinny under Ver 0.12.7 will randomly to a (up to 0.5sec) mute with a sometimes perceptible picture disturbance as it restarts. Probably just annoying during a movie but really annoying if the info in the audio is important!

Green
20-05-2008, 11:39 PM
Software Deliverables:
Description
Filename
Application image
TVNZ_1.0.5.sqsh


Smells like a LZMA compressed squashfs file system to me.

Does anyone know if this upgrade will be available any other way besides OTA?

Apsattv
20-05-2008, 11:41 PM
A copy might appear somewhere sometime soon ;)

openmedia
21-05-2008, 12:55 AM
A copy from which we can extract the code will be sufficient for contacting freeview themselves. As the firmware is distributed by their infrastructure, or atleast kordia's, we can approach them about source code access.

Apsattv
21-05-2008, 02:28 AM
Is this of any help? it was in the update file doc.

Zinwell Corporation
No. 2, Wen-Hua Road, Hsinchu Industrial Park
Hsinchu Hsien 303, Taiwan
TEL: +886-3-597-9050
FAX: +886-3-597-8857

Green
21-05-2008, 10:11 AM
A copy from which we can extract the code will be sufficient for contacting freeview themselves. As the firmware is distributed by their infrastructure, or atleast kordia's, we can approach them about source code access.


It looks like the update will only be for the application layer - and I don't think there is any GPL code in there (although I'd be more than happy to be wrong on this). I think you'd need to wait for a kernel update to see GPL code being distributed.

Geekster
21-05-2008, 02:25 PM
I'm not trying to advertise, but if anyone wants to access the serial/debug port on the Zinwell, this trademe member (http://www.trademe.co.nz/Members/Listings.aspx?member=101251) is selling USB to serial cables (http://www.trademe.co.nz/Computers/Cables/USB/auction-155891894.htm) that work at the required 3.3v instead of the standard 5v. All you need then is a female DB9 connector (http://www.dse.co.nz/cgi-bin/dse.storefront/483379320131be802742c0a87f3b06b6/Product/View/P2685) and some wires.

BigAl
21-05-2008, 09:48 PM
My box from DSE is running 12.7 as well

I have noticed a few bugs over the last few weeks - how many have seen/heard the following?:

The info bar getting locked into history mode
The tiny little gaps in the audio
The video freezing up, while the audio keeps going

Any other bugs anyone else hopes will get fixed???

I also notice that the sound is not stereo

kiwisteve
21-05-2008, 10:01 PM
Only issue I have is after box has been running continously for about a week the info bar goes to sleep and the EPG wont load .
A power off and on by the remote reactivates it

No freeze frames no audio issues
sound is in stereo but not all programmes

MorriTheCat
22-05-2008, 08:23 AM
I also notice that the sound is not stereo

do you mean that all stereo ceases AFTER there's been an audio 'mute' crash or was it because the program you were watching at the time was in Mono anyway?

BigAl
27-05-2008, 03:54 AM
no stereo sound at all

but havent tryed it on Coaxial and Optical sound yet

Geekster
27-05-2008, 12:22 PM
Just wondering, is there any way to flash a NZ box back to NZ firmware, as, to my knowledge, there are no publicly available .zim's for NZ. Is it possible to get a local box to spit out a copy?

kiwisteve
27-05-2008, 03:52 PM
Try Next eletronics

BigAl
30-05-2008, 01:21 AM
i notice tonight that tv3 is now in ac3 sound

kiwisteve
30-05-2008, 09:10 AM
Yes a nice big Blue LED now lights up on my cinema amp
be interesting to see how the movies sound

Just hope tvnz follow !! :D:D:D:D

Rose
31-05-2008, 10:53 AM
[QUOTE=Apsattv;1365]Posted by Green
31-03-2008, 11:34 PM

I have just upgraded my Zinwell ZMT-620FTA Freeview|HD receiver with the Olevia ZMT-620FTA firmware - and can now record to an attached USB HDD (with limitations).

UNQUOTE

Too chicken to blow away the supplied firmware yet, esp as there seems no solution yet for the missing EPG and sound issues . I did however buy a powered USB HDD and plug it into the USB port of the box (running 12.7 firmware). The zinwell doesnt find a HDD drive there when I look under the s/w upgrade menu, but it does locate a USB stick when one of them is inserted.

Does the box only start to look for hard disks with the hongkong firmware loaded, or is there something amiss with the HDD format? Disk works fine on a windoz PC, both in its powered and non-powered modes.

When is the over the air upgrade coming, and do we get a choice of loading it or not? My DTH Freeview zinwell asked me if I wanted upgrades some months back, I wonder if the DTT one will behave the same or if its going to be forced on us? I havent seen any setting or flag in the menu system to tell the box if it should accept upgrades over the air or not. If its forced, will the brave souls who moved to hongkong firmware be moved back to NZ code?

Comical Ali
31-05-2008, 02:50 PM
Yes a nice big Blue LED now lights up on my cinema amp
be interesting to see how the movies sound

Just hope tvnz follow !! :D:D:D:D

I notice that the ads, non-HD programs are in stereo AC3 only (even Rove which is HD) - and not as loud. When a 5.1 signal turns up (movie or ad for movie) its much louder and has significantly more LFE. Anyone else notice this?

kiwisteve
31-05-2008, 03:22 PM
yes thats quite common even on DVD playbacks
will see what Jurassic Park sounds like tonight

Apsattv
31-05-2008, 07:45 PM
[QUOTE=Apsattv;1365]Posted by Green
31-03-2008, 11:34 PM



Too chicken to blow away the supplied firmware yet, esp as there seems no solution yet for the missing EPG and sound issues . I did however buy a powered USB HDD and plug it into the USB port of the box (running 12.7 firmware). The zinwell doesnt find a HDD drive there when I look under the s/w upgrade menu, but it does locate a USB stick when one of them is inserted.

Does the box only start to look for hard disks with the hongkong firmware loaded, or is there something amiss with the HDD format? Disk works fine on a windoz PC, both in its powered and non-powered modes.



The USB is active and the firmware that is floating around gets loaded via the USB stick.

Rose
31-05-2008, 11:06 PM
[QUOTE=Rose;1766]


The USB is active and the firmware that is floating around gets loaded via the USB stick.

Yup, my box locates a usb stick, so I agree the port is active - my question is, does anyone elses box running NZ 12.7 (like mine) find a HDD if one is plugged in , or is it only the boxes running hongkong firmware that know about HDD devices?

edgerider
01-06-2008, 10:50 PM
I was talking to one of the Australian Zinwell reps last month and he suggested a new USB hard drive was due for release in September for the NZ market. Apparently "their" drive comes with the required firmware update file loaded on the drive. This loads on install making the USB drive fully available.

I asked about updates to the Firmware to enable the eth port for streaming and he said it was something they are working on. I only hope its soon. Communication on developments does not seem to be a strong point.

Does anyone know if the the 620 supports any remote programming codes for standard TV, video players etc. I have an old programmable remote that does not mention Zinwell, but I thought I read somewhere that the Zinwell supports NEC codes or something. Does not seem to work for me.

LennonNZ
01-06-2008, 11:15 PM
ok.. so far I have emailed:

zinwell
dse
freeview
next

and nothing regarding GPL Status/Copy of the source code.

Anyone have any ideas what to do now? Does anyone have any contacts in the companies involved who can give a definate answer on the GPL issue?

Maybe we can look into http://www.gpl-violations.org

Also you can see what happened/happening to another STB who is refusing to release stuff:
http://freebox.flouzo.net/

Green
02-06-2008, 12:03 AM
Does anyone know if the the 620 supports any remote programming codes for standard TV, video players etc. I have an old programmable remote that does not mention Zinwell, but I thought I read somewhere that the Zinwell supports NEC codes or something. Does not seem to work for me.

The console spits out hex codes for each IR button. I don't know if this could be useful for you - but I could tabulate the values generated by each button.

You might have problems with older programmable/learning remotes if Zinwell are now using the newer RC6 protocol.

edgerider
02-06-2008, 12:15 AM
The console spits out hex codes for each IR button. I don't know if this could be useful for you - but I could tabulate the values generated by each button.

Thanks Green that would be great if you could. I found a Hex database site that may allow me to trace back to a mainstream control type.

I'm most interested in the basic volume and channel buttons really.

kiwisteve
02-06-2008, 09:12 AM
When I press the zinwell remote the coship satellite receiver goes to different channels so may be similar !!

davisonja
02-06-2008, 11:38 AM
Thanks Green that would be great if you could. I found a Hex database site that may allow me to trace back to a mainstream control type.

I'm most interested in the basic volume and channel buttons really.

Is the DSE one the same?

kiwisteve
02-06-2008, 11:47 AM
DSE is Identical

LennonNZ
02-06-2008, 11:48 AM
Is the DSE one the same?

As far as I can tell (unless someone can put be wrong) they are the same thing.

G7503 DSE HD Terrestrial Receiver $399 (incl HDMI Cable)
G7504 Zinwell HD DVB-T Receiver $498 (no HDMI Cable)
G7503P DSE HD DVB-T Receiver $448 (incl HDMI Cable)

WHY 3 units which are the same with different prices and options (and the most expensive doesn't come with the cable?)

kiwisteve
02-06-2008, 12:00 PM
I suspect some retailers want more profit !! :D:D

davisonja
02-06-2008, 12:08 PM
DSE is Identical

In that case I can find out what codes the remote uses :)
Having just finished the prototype "wired" remote for the projectors here at work, I've learned more than one really should about iR codes.

edgerider
02-06-2008, 12:22 PM
Does anyone agree that Harvey Norman and the like should not be allowed to sell the Zinwell 620HD has as HD capable out of the box when in NZ you need an "optional extra" HDMI cable for HD. I was told you can get HD over component video, which is true, just not in NZ!

I'm thinking of going to Fairgo or something with this as I feel many people are being mislead. In fact often if people do go back to get HDMI cable they are up-sold on very expensive versions.:confused:

kiwisteve
02-06-2008, 12:27 PM
my DSE box had HDMI cable included .

Looks like a case of (( Buyer Beware )) and shop around for the best deal !

Green
02-06-2008, 02:15 PM
A friend of mine purchased a new TV recently which came with a 'free' Freeview STB. It arrived on Friday - it was a Zinwell but came _with_ an HDMI cable!

davisonja
02-06-2008, 02:52 PM
Does anyone know if the the 620 supports any remote programming codes for standard TV, video players etc. I have an old programmable remote that does not mention Zinwell, but I thought I read somewhere that the Zinwell supports NEC codes or something. Does not seem to work for me.

The remote I've got for the DSE box does, indeed, appear to use the NEC iR format. A newer 'extended address' version.
My Pronto neo is quite happy with the codes...

LennonNZ
03-06-2008, 12:57 PM
DSE have replied back to me and are contacting their supplier regarding the GPL issue of the Zinwell 620HD's

Geekster
04-06-2008, 12:45 PM
DSE have replied back to me and are contacting their supplier regarding the GPL issue of the Zinwell 620HD's

Care to elaborate? I haven't heard from anyone who I've emailed about this (zinwell, busybox, and freeview).

LennonNZ
04-06-2008, 02:04 PM
Care to elaborate? I haven't heard from anyone who I've emailed about this (zinwell, busybox, and freeview).

I got an email back (it took two emails and quite a long time frame) from a DSE Staff Member saying:

"We are in contact with the supplier, as soon as we get the requested
information, we will forward it to you. "

Thanks
Craig

MorriTheCat
06-06-2008, 01:34 PM
i notice tonight that tv3 is now in ac3 sound

everything coming out of my Zinwell 620 is showing as AAC delivered as is the standard for HD in NZ.

Still haven't seen Dolby wake up such that 5.1 would be encoded though....

trig
07-06-2008, 05:08 AM
Ditto that.

However my amp does say Channel 3 is outputting DD. The sound however is far from it. No rears is the obvious and no frontal sound stage.:confused:

MorriTheCat
07-06-2008, 11:11 AM
Ditto that.

However my amp does say Channel 3 is outputting DD. The sound however is far from it. No rears is the obvious and no frontal sound stage.:confused:

or do you mean TV3? (there is no TV station in NZ called Channel3)....

kiwisteve
07-06-2008, 11:25 AM
It will probably depend on what the source has in the way of encoding ,
most will probably be L+R for TV rather than DD . I presume its what they order in from the distributor :D:D

Green
07-06-2008, 12:01 PM
Sorry for the delay, but here is the list of key codes reported to the console when you push a button on the remote. Hope it can be of some use to those with programmable remotes.

9f7887 Menu
9f3ac5 Up
9fba45 Down
9ffa05 Right
9f7a85 Left
9f12ed Ch+
9fe21d Ch-
9f9a65 Vol+
9f1ae5 Vol-
9f38c7 Mute
9f906f 1
9fb847 2
9ff807 3
9fb04f 4
9f9867 5
9fd827 6
9f8877 7
9fa857 8
9fe817 9
9f6897 0
9f48b7 Info
9fa05f Recall
9f30cf List
9f10ef Enter
9fb24d V. Format
9f02fd A. Ratio
9f609f EPG
9fda25 Exit
9f28d7 Audio
9fc837 TTX
9ff00f Subt
9fea15 Red
9f708f Green
9f58a7 Yellow
9f50af Blue
9f00ff File
9fc03f Picture
9f728d TV/Radio
9f42bd Text
9f08f7 Power


If you hold down a button then an extra '80' byte gets prepended - for example, holding down the Ch+ button results in the code 809f12ed.

PS. No key codes are reported for the buttons on the front panel.

trig
07-06-2008, 06:12 PM
Sorry yes, TV3

edgerider
07-06-2008, 09:29 PM
Sorry for the delay, but here is the list of key codes reported to the console when you push a button on the remote. Hope it can be of some use to those with programmable remotes.

Cheers thanks for that green.:):):)

Rose
07-06-2008, 11:59 PM
[QUOTE=Green; Hope it can be of some use to those with programmable remotes.
.[/QUOTE]

I havent looked myself, but I am told the web database for the Harmony 525 remote now knows about the Zinwell 620. When I added mine to my home theatre a few months back, it certainly wasnt there, and I had to 'learn' all the codes one by one. I wonder if thats how Logitech update the database - use the work of early adopters...

andrewcnz
08-06-2008, 09:09 AM
Has anyone heard about a hard drive add on for the Zinwell that provides a PVR
function?

paulw
08-06-2008, 05:25 PM
I havent looked myself, but I am told the web database for the Harmony 525 remote now knows about the Zinwell 620. When I added mine to my home theatre a few months back, it certainly wasnt there, and I had to 'learn' all the codes one by one. I wonder if thats how Logitech update the database - use the work of early adopters...

Yes. I believe that is how it's done. When you set the remote to learn mode and upload to your Harmony it also uploads to the Harmony database. Hence the reason that leaser known items are quite often wrong

edgerider
08-06-2008, 09:09 PM
Has anyone heard about a hard drive add on for the Zinwell that provides a PVR
function?

Hi, yes as I mentioned in a previous post:

I was talking to one of the Australian Zinwell reps last month and he suggested a new USB hard drive was due for release in September for the NZ market. Apparently "their" drive comes with the required firmware update file loaded on the drive. This loads on install making the USB drive fully available.

I asked about updates to the Firmware to enable the eth port for streaming and he said it was something they are working on. I only hope its soon. Communication on developments does not seem to be a strong point.

Does this help?:):)

BigAl
15-06-2008, 12:42 AM
any word on the firmware update?

and is it done over air?

if so how do you know if it updated

kiwisteve
15-06-2008, 08:00 PM
Check the latest date in the info section of receiver ,
should be around Feb

BigAl
16-06-2008, 06:11 AM
I know how to check it

but a few weeks ago Apsattv posted
there was a new firmware being tested

http://forum.dtvforum.co.nz/showpost.php?p=1668&postcount=131

just want to know any word on it

MorriTheCat
16-06-2008, 10:58 AM
I've been 'testing' the Zinny i flashed with the Olevia PVR software and find it is now recording audio when i set a record off TV3. This would indicate the Olevia software needs AC3 Dolby (as we all thought was the case) of which ** O N L Y ** TV3 is providing. As i don't have a spdif input decoder (home theartre) i can't confirm proper 5.1 yet off TV3 but there most certainly is two channel audio (sometimes in stereo when there's music etc) out of the analogue audio RCAs of the 620.

Anyone know if the other sources to DTT are going to give us AC3Dolby 5.1??? Seems very strange why TV3 has done the extra work when someone like TVNZ hasn't moved (considering all the resources a State Controlled Broadcaster has at its disposal)!!!

paulw
16-06-2008, 02:24 PM
I've been 'testing' the Zinny i flashed with the Olevia PVR software and find it is now recording audio when i set a record off TV3. This would indicate the Olevia software needs AC3 Dolby (as we all thought was the case) of which ** O N L Y ** TV3 is providing. As i don't have a spdif input decoder (home theartre) i can't confirm proper 5.1 yet off TV3 but there most certainly is two channel audio (sometimes in stereo when there's music etc) out of the analogue audio RCAs of the 620.

Anyone know if the other sources to DTT are going to give us AC3Dolby 5.1??? Seems very strange why TV3 has done the extra work when someone like TVNZ hasn't moved (considering all the resources a State Controlled Broadcaster has at its disposal)!!!

I don't see TVNZ doing any AC3 until they start to transmit in HD..
Still don't know why AAC was used for the DTT system in NZ..

MorriTheCat
16-06-2008, 03:50 PM
I don't see TVNZ doing any AC3 until they start to transmit in HD..
Still don't know why AAC was used for the DTT system in NZ..

So is TV1 and TV2 still in standard def? I thought the least they were doing was up-scaling the station outputs to their 1280x720p res or is it a fudge on the DTT stream to make my Zinny report "HD" for the two?

kiwisteve
16-06-2008, 04:32 PM
perhaps aunty Helen hasnt given tvnz any money for AC3 !! :D:D:D

openmedia
16-06-2008, 04:42 PM
So is TV1 and TV2 still in standard def? I thought the least they were doing was up-scaling the station outputs to their 1280x720p res or is it a fudge on the DTT stream to make my Zinny report "HD" for the two?

TVNZ are running upscaled 720p for TV1 and TV2.

So what do people want for the freeview|HD audio standard

HE-AAC - Good quality for a relatively low bitrate
MP2 - good enough quality but a medium bitrate
AC3 - issues due to high bitrate and confusing to consumers if constantly switching between 2ch and 5.1 ch etc.

Personally wouldn't expect to see AC3 on anything other than the big 3 channels.

Also a lot of the docs on transmitting H.264 over DVB recommend HE-AAC for the audio.

Steve

kiwisteve
16-06-2008, 07:29 PM
AC3 D D suits me fine as STB connected to Cinema amp
would like to see DTS but they wont happen any time soon !

paulw
16-06-2008, 07:46 PM
AC3 with DD5.1 will do me fine..

openmedia
16-06-2008, 09:44 PM
AC3 with DD5.1 will do me fine..

Problem is what do you do about the shows that don't have AC3?

Also at upto 5/6 channels per multiplex if they all run 384K AC3 streams that is a lot of bandwidth compared with 5/6 64K AAC Streams.

wiredr
16-06-2008, 10:33 PM
maybe a lot of bandwidth compared to aac but compared to the video stream it is less than 3% . i have both aac and ac3 audio from tv3 and ac3 has more depth and clarity but the vocals on the center speaker are pretty much unchanged.

Apsattv
16-06-2008, 10:35 PM
Topic is getting a bit sidetracked do you want me to splitt it off to its own thread?

Sione
17-06-2008, 03:49 AM
Analysis of existing firmware updates


Hi Green, do you or anyone else here still have a copy of the Firmware Version 1.02 you could send me please? I searched for 2 hours on the net, found the others but not v1.02....thanks.:;):

I also noticed some guy was selling one with the "latest firmware" v1.4.2
copy and paste below:

OLEVIA ZMT-620FTA high-definition digital radio receivers

95% new. Bought from Broadway on Feb08, still under warranty. Latest firmware version 1.4.2 supporting EPG recording and enable / disable HDCP (May compatible with some old LCD TV which doesn't support HDCP when using HDMI). Full set with remote, box and invoice.

LennonNZ
17-06-2008, 03:13 PM
I have contacted DSE again and they are still actively trying to get the source code of the Zinwell 602HD (Parts which are GPL based). Let me say they are the only people who have actually replied back to me (and I have emailed everyone else concerned with the Zinwell in NZ and Overseas) and they are doing well at the moment.

I guess the issue is the Zinwell runs Software which is based on GPL software which means (which they have not done):

Include the GPL License with the product and make clear it does include GPL Software.
Make the source code Available (witten offer for it) and say where they can get it from including any newer versions etc

(and if you say -- hey DSE is only selling the box). Well the GPL license says they have to . DSE are the people who are selling it to the end user. Zinwell (legally - I am not a GPL licensing expert) have to supply DSE it and DSE have to give it to me)

I don't know what DSE will be doing from now on (and other companies who are selling the non-rebradged Zinwell 620HD) but I suggest they do something.
Saying this I have not contacted the other companies who are selling the non-rebadged Zinwell units (freeviewshop,noelleemings,lvmartin+son etc etc etc), but I would love to hear their side of the story. ( I guess they don't know it included GPL Software)

Then there is the Media. and other people around the world who go after GPL Violaters.

if anyone wants to publiclly (or privately) comment please feel free to.
Thanks

openmedia
17-06-2008, 04:53 PM
I have contacted DSE again and they are still actively trying to get the source code of the Zinwell 602HD (Parts which are GPL based). Let me say they are the only people who have actually replied back to me (and I have emailed everyone else concerned with the Zinwell in NZ and Overseas) and they are doing well at the moment.

I guess the issue is the Zinwell runs Software which is based on GPL software which means (which they have not done):

Include the GPL License with the product and make clear it does include GPL Software.
Make the source code Available (witten offer for it) and say where they can get it from including any newer versions etc

(and if you say -- hey DSE is only selling the box). Well the GPL license says they have to . DSE are the people who are selling it to the end user. Zinwell (legally - I am not a GPL licensing expert) have to supply DSE it and DSE have to give it to me)

I don't know what DSE will be doing from now on (and other companies who are selling the non-rebradged Zinwell 620HD) but I suggest they do something.
Saying this I have not contacted the other companies who are selling the non-rebadged Zinwell units (freeviewshop,noelleemings,lvmartin+son etc etc etc), but I would love to hear their side of the story. ( I guess they don't know it included GPL Software)

Then there is the Media. and other people around the world who go after GPL Violaters.

if anyone wants to publiclly (or privately) comment please feel free to.
Thanks

Great work pushing this. It would appear that the core of the OS is based on the wind river Linux suite, with a binary Zinwell STB application running over the top. Hence the source won't give us the code of the STB gui etc.

LennonNZ
17-06-2008, 05:18 PM
Great work pushing this. It would appear that the core of the OS is based on the wind river Linux suite, with a binary Zinwell STB application running over the top. Hence the source won't give us the code of the STB gui etc.

Yes. but if we can get the source of the kernel to run on it then we can start ourselves to put whatever we want on it.

The real point is companies should think of GPL the same as as any other copyrighted bit of software and follow the rules.

Do you think all Zinwell 620HD's should stop being sold until the GPL issues has been sorted out?

LennonNZ
17-06-2008, 05:24 PM
Another thing to think about. as quoted by the shouting zinwell person (whoever he was).

AMAZED TO SEE SO MANY 'TECHIES' INTERESTED IN VIEWING THE ZINWELL FREEVIEW DVB-T ZMT-620HD RECEIVER HOWEVER;---

1. UNAUTHORISED SW CHANGE TO THE ZMT-620HD RECEIVER WILL VOID THE RECEIVER WARRANTY.

As the operating system is GPL based software can they deny a warrenty if I changed the Operating system ? (as they don't own the Operating system on it and cannot tell anyone what they can do with GPL software) and they only certain applications on the box they have the copyright for?

Ie if I buy a laptop with windows and put linux on it it doesn't invalidate the warrenty

Thanks

Green
17-06-2008, 10:38 PM
Analysis of existing firmware updates


Hi Green, do you or anyone else here still have a copy of the Firmware Version 1.02 you could send me please? I searched for 2 hours on the net, found the others but not v1.02....thanks.:;):

I also noticed some guy was selling one with the "latest firmware" v1.4.2
copy and paste below:


All firmwares should be available on http://www.schot.com (Their web site does seem to have 'spells' from time to time, but as of right now, 1.0.2 is present and can be downloaded (http://www.schot.com/eng/download/Olevia_V1_0_2%20with%20font.zim)).

I'm guessing/hoping that the reference to 1.4.2 is a typo and should read 1.2.4 instead. Schot.com have just updated their site with a recording guide (posted 10 June) and it still just references 1.3.9.

Sione
18-06-2008, 01:32 AM
:_fiu:Thanks Green, much appreciated...I tried last night but it was down...however it is working now as you have pointed out :_sii:

JohnBoy
18-06-2008, 07:14 PM
Hi Guys, have been following this thread for a while, and picked up a DSE box last week, not bad for a basic box, nice clear pictures on my philips 32PF7.

However I want to start playing with it and have downloaded the Olevia firmware, but before doing an upgrade I want to be able to revert to the current firmware (Freeview NZ-HD version 0.12.7). I have not been able to find this firmware anyware :confused:. So does anyone know were I can get it?

Also if you are going to DSE to buy one of these check their web site before going, the web price was $399, but instore it was $458. I told the guy I was only going to pay $399 and he said that's fine, no presure applied at all.

Cheers

Green
18-06-2008, 09:07 PM
However I want to start playing with it and have downloaded the Olevia firmware, but before doing an upgrade I want to be able to revert to the current firmware (Freeview NZ-HD version 0.12.7). I have not been able to find this firmware anyware :confused:. So does anyone know were I can get it?

No such luck - it's a one way street at the moment.

Do or do not... there is no try.

Apsattv
23-06-2008, 04:55 AM
Found some more forum discussion of the Zinwell 620 DTT box

Maybe Vin could translate?

http://www.tvrobbs.com/showthread.php?threadid=7826

robjg63
23-06-2008, 10:51 AM
Found some more forum discussion of the Zinwell 620 DTT box

Maybe Vin could translate?

http://www.tvrobbs.com/showthread.php?threadid=7826

Hi all - I put this link through google translate and you can get the gist of the discussion (sort of). The image is the NZ box - But it appears the report is coming out of Taiwan.

Anyway - The coolest thing is the mention of the ability to record to USB device. Did I miss something earlier - I thought this has been mentioned so far as not having been implemented - maybe not implemented on our specs? Google translate says:

"The most important feature is that with usb drives, zinwell 620-speed can be turned into a video set-top boxes. Look at programs, at any time by clicking on the remote control of a [picture] button, it will immediately start recording, Once again press the [picture] key, video on the closure, while usb drive inside a folder on the record_video automatically generated a mpg video files. EPG video can also use the e-booking program to include video, make an appointment to a , The table will automatically start recording."

Nice - Does this work on our Freeview yet?

Apsattv
23-06-2008, 07:59 PM
Its available in the Hong Kong market that's why they are discussing it.

danger
23-06-2008, 10:11 PM
This may be old news but when searching for other firmware for the Zinwell 620HD I discovered that in addition to the Olevia branded version for DMB-T/H (or DTMB) in Hong Kong there is a Zirok branded version for ISDB-T in Brazil.

I found firmware 1.5.5 at http://www.zinwell.com.br/isdb/isdbt_firm.htm

The firmware seems to support some of the features that the SCHOT firmware provides for the Olevia version.

Looking at the ISDB info on wiki it seems that the audio is broadcast in AAC.

Perhaps there is another version of the Zinwell box for a country that broadcasts in DVB-T and they provide the firmware?

evilone
24-06-2008, 12:48 PM
Is there a easy way to get into the actual command line of this device? The CFE is easy, Ctrl+C on bootup, the actual command line is proving to be much harder.

Edit; found it out for myself, Ctrl+\ gives you a BusyBox prompt while unit is powered on fully.

LennonNZ
24-06-2008, 03:06 PM
Is there a easy way to get into the actual command line of this device? The CFE is easy, Ctrl+C on bootup, the actual command line is proving to be much harder.

Edit; found it out for myself, Ctrl+\ gives you a BusyBox prompt while unit is powered on fully.

Can someone send me a copy of the output from a standard zinwell with standard NZ software when it boots?

You can look at this about the CFE commands
http://melbourne.wireless.org.au/files/wrt54/cfe.pdf

evilone
24-06-2008, 03:10 PM
I've attached a copy of the boot up from a standard box.

Green
24-06-2008, 09:28 PM
Is there a easy way to get into the actual command line of this device? The CFE is easy, Ctrl+C on bootup, the actual command line is proving to be much harder.

Edit; found it out for myself, Ctrl+\ gives you a BusyBox prompt while unit is powered on fully.

That's really interesting! Now knowing this, you should be able to kill the main UI process and copy the app to a USB card. It would be really interesting to see if this app works on a Hong Kong kernel.

Of course, the opposite is also possible - you could try running a HK app from a USB card and see how well it fares on an unmodified NZ device.

evilone
24-06-2008, 11:36 PM
That's really interesting! Now knowing this, you should be able to kill the main UI process and copy the app to a USB card. It would be really interesting to see if this app works on a Hong Kong kernel.

Of course, the opposite is also possible - you could try running a HK app from a USB card and see how well it fares on an unmodified NZ device.

Yeap. It basically crashes the app itself, the video freezes once you're in a console, but the audio continues, so there shouldn't be much to crashing it completely.

Green
25-06-2008, 12:11 AM
I don't have a console cable to try this at the moment, but you should be able to list all processes by running the 'ps' command, and then use 'kill' with the process ID you find to terminate the process.

I believe that I've already posted the appropriate commands to mount a USB Flash device somewhere in this thread, which will then give you a directory you can copy files to.

LennonNZ
25-06-2008, 12:35 AM
I don't have a console cable to try this at the moment, but you should be able to list all processes by running the 'ps' command, and then use 'kill' with the process ID you find to terminate the process.

I believe that I've already posted the appropriate commands to mount a USB Flash device somewhere in this thread, which will then give you a directory you can copy files to.

There seems to be no ethernet module included :-( I'll have to see it I can cross compile an ethernet module for it and sshd/telnet binary

Can someone do a cat /proc/cpuinfo in busybox
and
printenv
show devices

in the CFE

would be ALOT easier if they didn't break the GPL Licence and gave us the code.
btw. I have contacted more people concerning this and if I get no where I may have to go to the media and see if they are interested.

Thanks

Geekster
26-06-2008, 01:19 PM
I have contacted more people concerning this and if I get no where I may have to go to the media and see if they are interested.

If you go to the media, PM me. I'll add my voice. Maybe then they'll think it's a bit more interesting. Are you thinking 6 o'clock news, or Fair Go?

LennonNZ
26-06-2008, 01:27 PM
I've already started a "simple" webpage of the problem

http://www.testmyspeed.co.nz/zinwell

I have quite a bit to update on it but if anyone wants to email me more info craig@orcon.net.nz

Geekster
26-06-2008, 01:30 PM
Nice.

Green
27-06-2008, 12:18 AM
Don't forget to add squashfs to the list of GPL violations...

LennonNZ
27-06-2008, 01:48 AM
I got my new STB box today and its running the same kernel as the zinwell

Linux version 2.6.12-4.0-brcmstb build version 2612-4.0 (amingliu@vega) (gcc version 3.4.6) #2 Tue Jun 24 13:19:05 CST 2008

more /proc/cpuinfo
system type : BCM97xxx Settop Platform
processor : 0
cpu model : Brcm7401 V0.0
cpu MHz : 295.93
BogoMIPS : 295.93 ( udelay_val : 147968 HZ = 1000 )
wait instruction : yes
microsecond timers : yes
tlb_entries : 32
extra interrupt vector : yes
hardware watchpoint : no
ASEs implemented :
VCED exceptions : not available
VCEI exceptions : not available
RAC setting : I/D-RAC enabled
unaligned access : 42613

if these are the same then I can give you a copy of ifconfig telnetd sshd etc to run on the zinwell

LennonNZ
27-06-2008, 02:42 AM
I just tried running the zinwell binary on the STB I have here and it runs (well crashes soon after running but its seems its a very similar box) so..

it means I can easily (most likely) get ppl all the files needed to allow netaccess to the zinwell's it seems buy copying the needed binarys off this box I have. (even the linux kernel is the same as the bcmdriver loads in perfectly in as well)

Craig

LennonNZ
27-06-2008, 02:43 AM
Don't forget to add squashfs to the list of GPL violations...

squashfs is GPLv2?

Geekster
27-06-2008, 10:19 AM
squashfs is GPLv2?

Well according to wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SquashFS)


Squashfs (.sfs) is a free (GPL) compressed read-only file system for the Linux kernel.

I can't be bothered to download it to check and see which version it is.

Green
27-06-2008, 10:21 AM
From the squashfs readme:


SQUASHFS 3.3 - A squashed read-only filesystem for Linux

Copyright 2002-2007 Phillip Lougher <phillip@lougher.demon.co.uk>

Released under the GPL licence (version 2 or later).

evilone
27-06-2008, 12:52 PM
...

if these are the same then I can give you a copy of ifconfig telnetd sshd etc to run on the zinwell

That'd be awesome. I started working on getting the ethernet working etc, but just ran out of time.

LennonNZ
27-06-2008, 01:07 PM
That'd be awesome. I started working on getting the ethernet working etc, but just ran out of time.

1st of all in the CFE is the ethernet enabled?

Also it looks like the zinwell unit NZ default doesn't have any networking support in the kernel, but my kernel (different box does)

Zinwell:
Linux NoNET1.0 for Linux 2.6

Myone:
<6>NET: Registered protocol family 16
<4>Broadcom BCM740121 Ethernet Network Device v1.0 Jun 24 2008 13:17:40
<6>NET: Registered protocol family 24
<6>pegasus: v0.6.13 (2005/11/13), Pegasus/Pegasus II USB Ethernet driver
<6>drivers/usb/net/rtl8150.c: rtl8150 based usb-ethernet driver v0.6.2 (2004/08/27)
<6>NET: Registered protocol family 2
<6>NET: Registered protocol family 1
<6>NET: Registered protocol family 10
<6>NET: Registered protocol family 17


DSE (and no one else actually answered) has yet got back to me with any update.
:-(

LennonNZ
27-06-2008, 02:29 PM
Here is what I found the instructions on how things work.
Its in Korean but its quite readable. They go thru all the steps in actually getting a box working from the CPE. linux install/compile, netbooting it etc

the zinwell/mybox/others are based on a broadcom reference design which they give you all the code and brutus (which is kind like the frontend to it all which you see)

http://story4u.co.kr/wiki/index.php?url=elecshin&no=10545276&type=all

zinwell have written then own version of brutus (the zinwell app) and mine uses a commercial frontend called ANT Galio which is basically a web browser with hooks to do all the functions of the STB.

http://www.antplc.com/

these apps just use standard calls to the bcmdriver.ko (which actually does all the work)

Craig

evilone
27-06-2008, 03:03 PM
Yeah the Ethernet works in CFE, can't really do much with it besides ping though. Gotta get working on that. The DSE box I'm using has no support for the ethernet card inside the running system though, no modules anywhere on the OS for it either, quite annoying. :mad:

LennonNZ
28-06-2008, 06:50 PM
I have updated the GPL Violation Page a little. If people have email address they have sent emails/contacts/responses etc they would like to forward me regarding this (or any other information) it would help alot.

http://www.testmyspeed.co.nz/zinwell/

*Update (1/7/2008) - I got an email back from DSE saying they are not responsible at all and its upto Zinwell and to contact Zinwell (as far as I can tell reading the GPLv2 Licence they are wrong) (remember the zinwell's are actually rebadged to DSE and the documentation is DSE's as well). I also contacted a few more people with no responses yet from them.

danger
30-06-2008, 07:23 PM
I had a look at the manuals for the Zinwell 620HD and compared it to the DSE branded version and I noticed that the DSE one does not support the multimedia functions in the Channel - File menu.

I would be very interested in getting the Zinwell firmware as I have the DSE model. Does anyone know where I can download or get the firmware from?

Also what types of media does the Zinwell version support?

My DSE model has firmware 0.12.7

Thanks.

Geekster
04-07-2008, 12:28 PM
Good news. Aaron from BusyBox has replied. Bad news: We'll have to do all the legal chasing.

LennonNZ
04-07-2008, 06:10 PM
Good news. Aaron from BusyBox has replied. Bad news: We'll have to do all the legal chasing.

Can you forward me the response so I can update my geekzone blog.

http://www.geekzone.co.nz/LennonNZ/5305

lennon@orcon.net.nz or private on here

LennonNZ
04-07-2008, 06:13 PM
I had a look at the manuals for the Zinwell 620HD and compared it to the DSE branded version and I noticed that the DSE one does not support the multimedia functions in the Channel - File menu.

I would be very interested in getting the Zinwell firmware as I have the DSE model. Does anyone know where I can download or get the firmware from?

Also what types of media does the Zinwell version support?

My DSE model has firmware 0.12.7

Thanks.

Does anyone have an electronic version of the non-DSE 620HD Manual?

danger
04-07-2008, 11:32 PM
I found the non-DSE manual on the freeviewshop website at...
http://www.freeviewshop.co.nz/zinwell-zmt620hd-freeview-digital-terrestrial-receiver-p-477.html

4k7
04-07-2008, 11:33 PM
I have updated the GPL Violation Page a little. If people have email address they have sent emails/contacts/responses etc they would like to forward me regarding this (or any other information) it would help alot.

http://www.testmyspeed.co.nz/zinwell/

*Update (1/7/2008) - I got an email back from DSE saying they are not responsible at all and its upto Zinwell and to contact Zinwell (as far as I can tell reading the GPLv2 Licence they are wrong) (remember the zinwell's are actually rebadged to DSE and the documentation is DSE's as well). I also contacted a few more people with no responses yet from them.

I did a little hunting and came up with a possible contact name at Zinwell:
Whaddon Selby-Adams

Found it on http://griffinsgadgets.blogspot.com/2007/05/freeview-headaches.html

Maybe you could try emailing him and see if he could help, or knows who to contact.

4k7

LennonNZ
04-07-2008, 11:42 PM
I did a little hunting and came up with a possible contact name at Zinwell:
Whaddon Selby-Adams

Found it on http://griffinsgadgets.blogspot.com/2007/05/freeview-headaches.html

Maybe you could try emailing him and see if he could help, or knows who to contact.

4k7

Yes thats who owns zinwellaustralia.com.au. I had a look on the website and it has a contact form, (which is broken) but I looked in the php file and emailed the (it looks like the web developer asking for info)..

Thanks

Green
12-07-2008, 12:47 PM
FYI. Schot.com has a new firmware release available on their web site - v1.7.2.

danger
12-07-2008, 04:58 PM
FYI. Schot.com has a new firmware release available on their web site - v1.7.2.

Green, have you installed the new firmware? I presume that it does not fix the lack of AAC audio support or fix the broken MHEG5 epg?

Sione
12-07-2008, 06:38 PM
Green, have you installed the new firmware? I presume that it does not fix the lack of AAC audio support or fix the broken MHEG5 epg?

I installed it and guess what, the freeview EPG came Back!!!!, it's fantastic!:_lol:
Can't try the hard drive AAC though, someone else can do that

Sione
12-07-2008, 06:56 PM
Ok, now it has gone, weird.....:confused:

Apsattv
12-07-2008, 08:12 PM
Additional Function of Firmware ver 1.7.2



1. 於相同頻道同步錄影兩個節目, 收看第三個電視台

Recording two TV programs, and watching the third one in the same channel at the same time



2. 32 倍速搜畫

X 32 fast forward and backward



3. 時間切換

Time Shifting



4. 時間預錄

Time recording



5. 記憶播放

Memory play



6. 優化選擇播放錄影列表

Enhance the recorded play list



7. 優化預錄清單

Enhance EPG recording page



*錄影需另外購置外置硬盤機,建設使用OLEVIA ZHD-UBSP35 250GB硬盤機或建議使用3.5”, 160GB外置硬盤.(外置硬盤必須連接電源)



*OLEVIA Settop Box ZMT-620FTA does not include an external hard disk, OLEVIA ZHD-UBSP35 is recommended for recording. 3.5”, 160GB xternal hard disc with independent power supply is suggested



*注意:此軟體版本只可於ZMT-620FTA 軟體版本 1.2.2或以上作升級之用.但升級後,無法降回原本之軟體版本.如ZMT-620FTA未更新為軟體版本 1.2.2或以上,請先更新為軟體版本 1.2.2或以上,然後再更新軟體版本1.7.2



*Attention: This firmware is irreversible and only applicable to ZMT-620FTA firmware ver 1.2.2or above, please upgrade firmware ver 1.2.2or above before upgrading to firmware ver 1.7.2



*注意: 如預設錄影節目, 可於完成設定後關機, 於錄影時間前重新開啓電源即可.

*Attention: you can switch off the set top box after adding recording schedule. Please switch it on before the prerecord start time.

Apsattv
12-07-2008, 08:23 PM
USE AT YOUR OWN RISK READ REST OF THREAD FOR USER EXPERIENCE WITH THIS FIRMWARE


Title :
OLEVIA ZMT-620FTA 高清數碼廣播接收器
Post Date : 18 January, 2008



NEW Updated on 10-July-2008 - Firmware v1.7.2 part 1

NEW Updated on 10-July-2008 - Firmware v1.7.2 part 2

NEW Updated on 10-July-2008 - Firmware update user guide for v1.7.2

Apsattv
12-07-2008, 08:38 PM
I tried adding the 2 files into a zip and uploading but the upload kept failing for some reason?

Apsattv
12-07-2008, 08:40 PM
"Recording two TV programs, and watching the third one in the same channel at the same time"


So how are they doing this??

LennonNZ
12-07-2008, 10:27 PM
"Recording two TV programs, and watching the third one in the same channel at the same time"


So how are they doing this??

I guess if they are on the SAME transponder only as the hardware only has a single DVB-T tuner on it

Apsattv
12-07-2008, 11:17 PM
Well on the same mux/Frequency I guess? so a bit of a trick.

BigAl
13-07-2008, 04:50 PM
any one know when NZ firmware update going to be relesed?

danger
13-07-2008, 09:07 PM
any one know when NZ firmware update going to be relesed?

On the freeviewshop.co.nz forum there was a post on the 4th of July that said "1-2 weeks, Freeview has confirmed the update will be sent as an over the air update within this timeframe and the audio stop problem should be resolved". This implies it should happen before the 18th.

Apsattv
13-07-2008, 09:13 PM
Yes and if you read back in this thread there is a log file of the improvements in the software etc.

BigAl
13-07-2008, 11:19 PM
On the freeviewshop.co.nz forum there was a post on the 4th of July that said "1-2 weeks, Freeview has confirmed the update will be sent as an over the air update within this timeframe and the audio stop problem should be resolved". This implies it should happen before the 18th.

i see

it looks like it will be over air and having send the box to NEXT

and no internet download

Apsattv
13-07-2008, 11:23 PM
..unless someone leaks it.

danger
13-07-2008, 11:34 PM
Would it be possible to extract it from the box after the OTA download but before it is installed?

trig
14-07-2008, 07:50 PM
Hi Morris,

I have updated to this latest firmware, couldn't resist, and my blue LED has stopped working!

Any ideas what has happened?

Ta.

Dave.